Board of Public Works Meeting July 24, 2026

Right. Um, my name is Robert Almy. I'd like to um convene the Dartmouth Board of Public Works for Friday, July 24th, 2026.

Uh, this meeting is being recorded. It is being held in person.

Uh roll call. Mr. Leel here.

Mr. G present.

Chair is here. So all members are present and accounted for. Um we have two major tasks before us this afternoon. The first is uh to hold interviews for the board of public works. Um in that the town has gone through the approval process to increase our board from 3 to five. The second is um two licensed utility layer applications. Um I'm wondering if uh the board would prefer to take care of those first.

I think it makes sense to dispense with those. So be quick.

Okay. So under new business uh a Tim.

So uh we have a licensed utility layer application from Richio Excavation of Mansfield, Massachusetts. Has been in business for 35 years. Uh they submitted references reference letters from Stoton Development Services, Secon Water District and Canton DPW. All positive references. Uh they've also submitted all the required certificates of insurance and bond recommend uh approval of their license utility layer license.

Any questions, board members?

I don't.

Do I have a motion?

Has he ever worked in the town?

Not in Dartmouth.

No.

Okay.

Sorry. I'm I'm good. Thank you, Steve.

All right. Uh motion motion to approve.

Second.

Second.

Uh Mr. Leel, how do you vote?

Yes.

Mr. G, yes.

Chair votes yes. It's approved. Next one. Tim. Oh, by the way, we don't have to take roll call vote because we're meeting in person.

Okay.

For the record.

For the record.

So next is another licensed utility layer application from Lanzetta excavation of Hopedale Mass has been in business for 26 years and submitted reference letters from Hopedale Water and Sewer Milford Highway Department, Milford Sewer Department and Grafton Water District all positive references.

They have submitted the required certificates of insurance and their bond and they are currently uh working as a licensed right-of-way contractor and on a project in Dartmouth as well. So board members, any questions?

Do I have a motion?

Motion to approve.

Second.

It's been moved and seconded for approval. Mr. Label, how do you vote?

Yes.

Mr. Gier, yes.

Um chair votes yes. Items approved.

Okay. Next part of our uh agenda is interviews for board of public works members. Uh Tim, do you have any background on this for us?

Um uh board board of public works members are appointed by the select board. Um historically uh this board has been a a three member board. Um and in in the recent past uh it was requested to add two additional members to make this a five member board. It went before town meeting and was approved and then uh as a question on the the election as past April and that was approved and the

the select board and town administrator have asked the board of public works to interview uh prospective candidates for the uh for the positions. the two vacant positions today. Uh our [clears throat] first interview we have Richard Satel uh Setley, sorry. Sorry. Um everybody gets it.

Yeah, but I should know it. Um and uh if you you feel comfortable, you can either come up to the podium or you can have a seat um up here at one of these microphones.

Well, that's fine.

Okay.

That way I can look at you.

All right. I hope you don't think I'm underdressed, but I never wear long pants in the summertime.

No, it's fine.

Board members, uh, Mr. Leel, would you like to start?

Uh, just for the board, I I've known Mr.

Setley for a good number of years and, um, I know he's got extensive background in public works. Um, so I'm assuming we're asking Yeah, we can work through these off of off of this here, you know. Um, Mr. Sy, could you tell us about yourself?

Well, uh, I've been in and around engineering, civil engineering mostly since I was 19 years old. I went in the service. I was in combat engineers.

After attending the Army Engineering School in Fort Belva, Virginia, I got sent to Germany for three years and spent my time over there doing parade grounds, soccer fields, uh river crossing, uh swim areas for armored personnel carriers, things of that nature. Uh when I came back, I started at uh Tivis Engineering in 1966 uh mostly land surveying.

I was uh sent out in the field on a construction project when they were building I95 over the top of Wells Square. Uh it was recently down there uh just to watch what was going on because I love to watch construction. And uh I remember I had to walk those beams, the first ones, the ones that are up there now with a Philadelphia rod so that we could shoot the camber on every beam that they put

up. There were no guard rails. There was no ocean keeping an eye on you or anything else. Uh it was funny if you were on a beam and you had a beam on either side of you. Even though it was so far away you couldn't reach them, you felt comfortable with the minute you got on one of those outside beams when there was nothing over one side and scared you to death. So uh I'm watching that

project now because I was involved with it uh 50 years ago and it's fun to watch. It is um uh spent 20 odd years with Tibbitz on all sorts of projects in Dartmouth, in New Bedford, in Fair Haven, all over. Uh and enjoyed the work because it was something different almost every day. It might be water work one day, sewer work the next, airport runway work, buildings. Uh it it made life

interesting. A lot of the big engineering companies, you do the same thing all the time. At Tibbitis, you had to do anything and everything, and it really made it enjoyable.

Uh, I left there um and went to a uh development company in Taton.

Uh, and a a year after I got there, their big project burned to the ground and the company went out of business.

From there I went to Proctor and Gamble.

Did a lot of waterfront work at Proctor and Gamble in a couple years that I was there and after that uh I ended up as the superintendent of public works of the town of Mushnet.

So I was there for 10 years had the time in that I could retire. I retired in 2004. So I've been off the job for 22 odd years now.

And uh I'm at the point where I can't do a lot of heavy work, but I have a lot of time to do something. And so with the experience that I have, I would be more than happy to do whatever I can to help the town of Dartmouth. I live here. Uh I'm on uh close to the end of the that hill that you go over, so I might not have too

many years, but I certainly could do two or three years. And if I'm well at that time, possibly more.

And so I'm just volunteering because I have a lot of time on my hands and I'd love to have something to do quite honestly.

Thank you, Mike. Well, I knew Dick from the days when uh did a lot of stuff both between Dartmouth and the towns that surrounded New Bedford and when I went to Matt Boyce. Um, uh, Dick was involved quite a bit, um, in the conversations I used to have with Alcatino about different projects and funding. Um, and so I I'm quite familiar with it. Um, the background you just gave is very

interesting. Uh, I know Dartmouth when the days of Manny Branco, um, we did a lot of work with Tippets. I did a lot of work with Manny Branco.

I'm trying to think of the name. The guy that did the traffic stuff. I'm drawing a blank on his name.

JJ John Judson.

No. No.

No.

Dat worked for me.

Yeah. Worked for I had him when Tibbitz closed at city hall. Yeah.

Yeah. He uh he was he he did a lot of traffic stuff with us and uh uh we did a lot of work with Tibbitz. Uh very familiar with them. Tibbitz did a lot of work in Matapo when I was down there and then when they closed I think I can't think they closed like a few years ago I believe they sold out and then uh I think they sold a company finally to a testing company.

Yeah. SW Cole I believe.

Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. So I'm very familiar with uh Dick's background. And you and I met when you were the agent for the conservation commission. That's how far back it goes. 1981 1981 that's only 40 some more than 40 something years ago time flies that's really uh I don't really have any questions I mean a lot of these questions uh I'm very familiar with the uh experience this gentleman has

one of the things that I would you like to use our time on is I think you realize some of the situations If you're reading or watching some of our meetings, we're dealing with some pretty intense issues on wastewater plant capacity.

We're dealing with issues of, you know, very si significant limitations on the amount of aquifer drinking water we're able to produce, which is triggering uh substantial purchases from New Bedford.

Um, we got some hard issues ahead of us.

Well, you have the ideal person on the board because Ron Lel is familiar with New Bedford system more than anybody else probably.

We're in the we're in the midst of uh you know getting our CWMP uh underway. Um, but the reality is going to be, and I said it two weeks ago in the select boards meeting, there's going to be some significant costs because we had 1,400 residential units that are being built through eight different projects in Dartmouth and we're going to be well over the 80% capacity that triggers the D to say,

"What's your plans to to handle this situation?" So, you guys going have some challenges and uh I was very glad the board the town meeting and the select board agreed to move it to five because we're going to need a lot of brains, [snorts] you know, to put things together and make some very hard decisions and be able to stand behind those decisions. So, I think, you know, you've got some good experience and uh

I'm glad you applied.

Well, I would say that uh yes, that's correct.

But I do I haven't been in the trade for 20 years now. I knew the regulations inside and out when I retired uh from Tibbitz and town of Kushner. Uh but it has been a lag of 20 years. So I am not up to date quite honestly with all the new rules and regulations and they change all the time.

Right. So, I would uh be glad to catch myself up if they have the uh information that that I can take home and read.

Uh I have kept up somewhat with the newspapers, but newspapers aren't what they used to be anymore.

They have very few stories about what's going on. I never see the board of public works in the the chronicle until I saw the ad for uh two additional board members. So, you guys don't get reported on a whole lot. And I don't think the people in town realize what's coming down the road as far as cost for improvements in town.

What I'll leave that up to you that I am 20 years behind. Quite I'll be honest with that.

Generally speaking, you you've had a lot of experience working with and running a DPW.

What do you think success looks like?

[snorts] Uh I'm not quite sure what you mean it looks like but I expanded the sewer system in a cushion uh by 100%.

That was the one big project that I was very proud of. They had we had 600 and some uh 500 and some odd uh users of the sewer system and I was able to work with the select bin go up to Boston get the funding uh and whatnot for the construction of expansion doubling the size of the sewer system and uh I think that was very beneficial because the cushion was polluting the upper end of

the Kushet River. A lot of stuff was going in the old drains uh into the river. So, that's been cleaned up and I'm very uh very happy about that. [clears throat] And we had expansion of water systems and uh construction of chapter 90 construction of roadways, main street and whatnot. Uh which Christian didn't get a lot of big projects done before.

So, being used to working with chapter 90 projects and water and sewer and whatnot, I was able to go in there and get get something done in the short time that I was in there. Well, eight years, but a very small town compared to uh Dartmouth. Actually, population 10,000.

Well, I think the principles are the same.

I mean, I Well, I'm not going to downgrade a Kusha. They They were a small town.

Yeah. and they didn't have a lot of administration on public works. So, it's being an outsider, it's tough to get uh your point across to local selectment and whatnot if you're not a native. I mean, I was a New Bedford kid. I'm probably still a New Bedford kid. I don't even though I've been living here for 35 years. So, uh you can take the kid out of the city, but you can't take

the city out of the kid. I guess I know what it feels to be an an outsider even though the family's been around for a while.

Oh yeah, Ron. No, I I'm I'm like Mike. I you know, a lot of these are somewhat redundant the questions.

Um, you know, I I like what you just asked.

Um you know just you know Richard so you understand as the chair just you know pointed out to you that um the town is facing a lot of intense and expensive projects.

Uh it's going to be the next five and six years are going to be difficult here. Rates are going up.

There was an article in a paper today about it. my brother-in-law called me up and said, "What are you doing, Ron?"

And you know, it's it's going to get um it's going to get difficult especially for boards that are making these decisions.

Um so understand that.

Um, you know, I, you know, right now think that as the board exists, we got some depth of talent and knowledge and and that as a board member is what, you know, you know, we're we're looking to increase and enhance. You know, it's difficult now. I mean, I would like love to sit down in a room and and talk to Mike or sit down in a room and and and

talk to the chairman, but I can't do that. It's it's forum and it's difficult. You want to bounce ideas off people so that they can look at you and say, you know, great idea or you're out of your mind. Um but but um no, thank you, Mr. Chairman. I I'm good.

I I've known Richard as Mike has for, you know, a lot of my career. Um is there anything you would like to add, Mike?

Well, the only thing I would add is that when I first saw the ad in the Chronicle maybe a month ago now about the uh Tom meeting hadn't voted on the expansion yet at that time.

they were going to vote shortly after that point in in time and it passed. And there was the uh article in the the uh chronicle about the board uh seeking uh people to serve on the board. And I was thinking at that time about the development in the old golf course and on halfway road and up uh past UMass Dartmouth. And I'm thinking this is going to add a lot to water, sewer, fire

department, police department. It was I told my wife, be prepared. Taxes are definitely going up. I don't know what it's going to do to the school department. You have 1,400 houses.

That's probably 1,400 kids. I don't know if the president suit can support that without another building. And another building is $250 million. And a lot of that's going to be on the town because I think the state's only reimbursing at a rate of somewhere near 50%, maybe 60, maybe 40, I'm not sure, but it's going to be a big bill for the town of Dartmouth. And there'll be other bills

that come along, sewer treatment plant expansion, uh, uh, water supply. I mean, I saw the story about going to Fair Haven. I mean, to go in Fall River for water versus New Bedford.

I don't necessarily agree with that because New Bedford is a a stable system. I don't know about uh Fall River although they have new facilities over there also. I just don't know about their rate structure.

Uh I bought water from uh New Bedford when I was uh in Kushner.

Uh at that time I thought it was a little high and I thought they could have given us a break since we we took care of the system. They just provided the water and we were paying the same rate as as uh customers over in New Bedford. And I think Ron came to a meeting one one night with the board of public works over there to discuss that issue long long time ago. You may not

remember it.

Oh, I do many times.

Um I knew Alan Cino well.

Yeah. So, uh yes, I understand. And maybe that's one of the reasons I I came in and volunteered to this position. If uh I didn't expect you to have 12 uh people uh applying and I'm sure out of the 12, there's a lot of people better than I am as far as engineering goes. Uh but I saw the the bill come and do and I thought, well, maybe I can use uh my

experience and time to try to foster things along. But as uh Ron said, it's a slow process now because everything uh you get two members of a board together, a three-man board, and it's a public meeting.

You can't do it. Uh and so that makes things difficult to get done in any speed at all. And I understand that.

So, literally all of us have been in charge of running some kind of a government agency or agencies, public works included. Um, and yet the management, the day-to-day management falls to guys like this. Mhm.

How do you see the board providing support for the prof professional parts of the professional people in public works and yet allowing them to kind of run it their way?

Uh story. I went to a cushion. They never had a board of public works.

They passed a town meeting. They would go they were going to vote in five board members. They established their board of public works and they hired me and they hired me on a 10-year contract. I have no idea why, but I talked them into it.

I think it was because in 10 years I was going to do 62 and I knew I could get out. Uh that board thought there was no guidelines for what they were there for. They thought they were going to run the DPW, right? First day I got there, they were in the DPW yard trying to order people around. And so I said, "Look, you guys are here as as advisory to the superintendent and to

give a direction to the DPW."

And [clears throat] I think that's what the board should do is they provide direction of what we want to do this year, Tim. Uh what don't we want to do this year? What money do we have? Stuff like that. But go out and do it without uh day-to-day supervision or anything like that. You have a meeting once a month or whatever it is and uh the superintendent's always there and you discuss things. That's uh the board's

function as far as I know. Unless it's different in Dartmouth. Certainly got to be different than a cushion. I know that cuz that board ended up they had another town meeting and they fired the whole board and now the select can appoint uh whomever over there.

It worked for 10 years anyway, but after that gone.

That's it.

Any other questions?

I'm good.

Board members, I'm good. I'm good.

Okay. Anything else you'd like to leave us with?

Nope. I have a dinner date down the Cape for 4:00, so I'm ready to go.

Drive carefully.

If I could if I could ask. So, I know some sometimes we meet in person. Most of the time, right? Right now, we meet remotely. Are you comfortable with meaning both?

I may not be able to do that because I'm not online. I never intend to get online. I can't do I don't do Zoom or any of that. Uh I'm on the phone and that's it. If that doesn't work for you, I'm not going to change that. I decided to stay away from all that stuff years ago.

So Tim, uh we can hold hybrid meetings, right, with some in attendance and some not in attendance.

Absolutely. and that may with a five member board that may be something that happens. Um do you have a setup in public works that could accommodate that or is that a meeting that would have to be originated here?

Um currently we would probably have to work out of here but we could get the infrastructure okay at DPW.

Okay. Don't Don't go out of your way to change things to accommodate me.

All right.

Well, I put it a different way. You're not off the hook yet.

No, definitely not.

I'm not trying to get off the hook, but I know that I'm still living in the 80s and I'm happy as hell with that. Uh but and I don't want you to do anything that is going to uh jeopardize the smooth operation of your uh board of public works.

Okay.

All right. With that, thank you for your time.

Thank you. Thank you for your time.

Thank you.

Thank you.

And by the way, I want you to know that this girl pours the best uh Guinness you'll ever have.

And that's an eye porn against Thank you.

Thank you. It was a pleasure.

Thank you. Thank you.

Have a good evening.

You as well.

Yeah. Be careful on those damn bridges.

Okay. Um I think it would be useful to each of us reduce some kind of notes, not real long, but just a few notes and provide them to Tim and let him U put them together.

Sure.

Um we could have a discussion now. Uh but I think my own impression is um Mr. Sutley's uh qualifications are pretty significant and he seems like the kind of person who would understand relationship between the board and public works and what the board is supposed to be doing. So, how excuse me, Mr. Chairman, how how many candidates I' been kind of out of things here, but how many candidates do we have?

So, I know there's another here.

Yes.

One cancelled.

Yep.

Is are there any others?

Yes.

How many?

Uh, one's here and then we have one additional one.

Necks 20.

Two. Two additional.

Two more. Oh, good.

I'm sorry. Originally, there were 12 applicants.

I would like to see them all before I even We had 12 applicants. And then we chose, I believe, five of the 12 to interview.

Okay.

So, the other two will be interviewed a week from this Tuesday.

Um well, I believe we're looking at interviewing one this coming Tuesday, right?

Um and then one additional uh the following Monday.

Okay. So, I can do the following Monday, August 3rd.

All right. I'll be back for that one.

Yeah. the the other applicant uh or candidate couldn't couldn't attend on the third.

I will be here when he's not for sure.

So, yes.

So, we'll have a quarter.

Excellent.

Good. Yeah.

I was very impressed with the pool of candidates that we got. I mean, you got some very qualified people and actually I'm familiar with a couple of them and um I was very pleased to see that they decided to uh apply.

Absolutely. We had a lot of interest. It was great interest and a lot of qualifications, but it's great to see.

Tim, the um the person who's not coming today, have they withdrawn their application? Yes. So, we're down to four interviews, correct?

Okay.

That'll be a good pick. And just so the board knows, the next candidate worked for me. I hired him.

Just so you understand that, and you'll I'm sure speak to that to some degree.

Absolutely. Is is Yes, Mr. Richie. Yeah, Richie.

I know you know him, so

Jim, nice to see you.

Welcome.

Welcome, Tim. Barber, nice to see you, Jim. Been a while.

How are you?

Good.

Yeah.

Thank you.

You have the option. I'm sorry. Uh, however you feel comfortable to sit here or or stand at the podium.

Oh, I didn't see that.

Yes, sitting if you don't mind.

Sit right away. We're going to

Ron, I I just started off. Jim, I'm glad you're here. I'm glad you put your your noose in the your neck in the noose, but uh uh just would you mind giving us sort of an overview of your background and and the work that you've done and Okay.

things of that nature.

Um well, start at the beginning. Came to Dartmouth in 19 Excuse me. I just want to announce because this is recorded. So, Mr. James Richie uh applicant okay, for Board of Public Works.

Uh, came to Dartmouth in 1970 to go to UMass Dartmouth for SMU at the time.

Graduated marine biology degree. Um, married a Dartmouth girl month after that and uh, been here ever since.

Moved into the house next to her parents and now my daughter lives in her parents old house. So, we're uh pretty much uh well established in town. Uh [clears throat] I've started my career in in the environmental uh field uh at the New Bedford Wastewater Treatment Plant back when I was a primary plant. I was the [clears throat] chemist there. And what what year was that, Jim?

74.

December of 74.

and I worked there for about nine I think it was just just shy of 10 years.

Um went to from there I went to a private engineering firm GHR engineering which you might be familiar with. Um worked in [clears throat] the laboratory did a lot of their environmental uh sampling. Uh spent time roaming around Dartmouth landfill collecting samples of the wells and just about every landfill in the the area. Um [clears throat] also uh while I was [clears throat] with

the city uh initially I got my grade seven uh wastewater treatment plant operator's license. Um from there going back to again GHR a lot of environmental moni mon monitoring worked on hazardous way sites in Massachusetts and New York uh doing sampling and [clears throat] working with EPA uh sampling and shipping protocols. Uh also oversark uh a number of small package plants for uh

industry. There was one in industry up in uh handover that would that made books uh medical medical journals and books and they had their own treatment facility that I daily I went to and oversaw that a couple of schools down in the Cape and also a hotel down in the Cape. We did uh Cland Farms out in Westboro. I I worked out there uh a substitute for their operator when he went on vacation.

[clears throat] And then we did monthly inspections and that sort of thing. So in in the GHR uh also because we worked in the laboratory, I was involved in all the water quality sampling and and testing for a number of uh communities out far out to Franklin and uh down to the Cape over even over into Martha's Vineyard. We've got samples from them.

[clears throat] And that was, you know, either a bi-weekly sampling depending on the community or a monthly sampling uh for their testing for their compliance which you know we all we all do. Um from so there was a just you know a wide variety of anything that that the company did environmentally and in the laboratory that had to be done. Uh then I went back uh well GHR got sold and

kind of convoluted. I I kept trouble keeping track of it. I ended up working for the the laboratory portion for a couple of years. Uh and then went back to uh the city when the new treatment plant was being constructed.

[clears throat] When I came it was about 80% uh done at that time. Um and I [clears throat] was going to I was the liaison between the city and uh the operators. Uh I also oversaw some you know some of the construction uh as it went on particularly the startup uh and the training processes that we had there. uh got the [clears throat] you know the fac facility got online uh had

a few problems with odor and noise and what and got to stand up in front of the crowd and try to explain why the material has an odor. Um that was always interesting but uh um [clears throat] and like Ron might probably if you know Ron you know that everything that got done it was a team effort. So we were I was involved in everything from um pump stations, construction uh construction design um

being you [clears throat] again city liaison in some cases depending on the projects uh work at the at the the water facility where we we [clears throat] did a lot of big upgrade there. computer system upgrades on both water and wastewater.

uh solar uh installations at the water plant, Sullivan's Ledge, uh I oversaw Sullivan's Ledge, the startup, and the day-to-day uh operations uh together with uh dealing with EPA and first trying to get to the point where we could shut it down, which we managed to do for a couple of years, but now they've had to bring it back online because some of the levels are uh coming back up. [clears throat]

Um some of the Couple of things I'm most proud of that that I was involved was up at the uh the water plant where we uh worked with the Nature Conservancy and got [clears throat] both a grant for half a million dollars from the state and another half a million from the Nature Conservancy to put uh deed restrictions on um a couple hundred acres of property that didn't have restrictions on to begin with and

also worked with the state to do another deed restrict that opened up the entire uh waterworks property to public access. Um and also with within that property, I I worked on the um a [clears throat] timber uh po portion where we we did logging uh sold the sold the logs for a profit um or used it just did a cutting for the benefit of the the health of the forest.

Uh there was a good portion up there that uh had [clears throat] a pole uh size red pines that had all died. So we had acres and acres of just standing dead trees and we [clears throat] got that all cut down. That's where we had put 10 acres of um solar in there. Um, and I also uh adjacent to that where we cut out uh put in another 10,000 seedlings. So there

that was 15 years ago. So they're coming back pretty pretty strong now.

You were young.

Um I think I did about 10 10 to 12 cutings where we you know we would go out to be our forester would map out an area. would get a number of board feet uh then go out to bid for someone to come in and cut it and and you know they'd take the wood and we'd get the profit. Couple of times we didn't make any money but we were doing the

improvement to the forest with all this dead standing timber that was just potential firewood. Uh we also did a one uh on the hardwoods uh after gypsy moths uh really decimated the place.

I've been involved in you know again all sorts of projects, anything that you we can possibly think of. U I did the NPDES permit which they still don't have. That was 15 years ago I applied for that. um um [clears throat] monthly reports [snorts] uh regarding the uh operation of uh the treatment facility for the consent [clears throat] decree uh that we had at the time. Um annual reports uh for on [clears throat]

the facility as well. Um I'm trying to it's hard to come up with We've been been involved in so many things that um I I was involved with the demolition of Aravox oversaw all the paperwork uh making sure that we got all of the u the sheets for the disposal uh in line and reported correctly and um that was that was interesting. I think the paperwork is still down at the plant

and about 15 boxes or so. Um the oddball that we, you know, do that.

We were involved with a at the airport uh bringing the the force man moving the force man out from under the u uh landing path uh going around such a variety of things that you know that you would it's it's the building of the parks in the south end the pump stations both wastewater and water uh force means inspections of our big uh 42 in uh force means uh pipe installations.

You you name it, we did it. Plowed snow, towed cars.

What year did you return to the city?

90 I think it was probably 95 because I I was we started the 96 of the plant I think we had a little ways to go. So and then what year did you leave?

Uh 2014.

Yeah.

The only reason I ask is the descriptive narrative on this um system that the town uses for applicants to apply. It doesn't give us too much as far as dates.

Yeah.

So that that's very helpful. So that's that's almost 20 years you're back with the city plus the time you were there before. Okay.

Thank you, Mr. Gier. Any questions?

Wow. I I did learn something today because I've always known Jim from the work that he was doing at the wastewater plant because um I was town administrator here and during some of that time we would meet jointly with New Bedford um with the mayors at you know particular times and Jim and Ron you know would be at the meetings and uh that was the background I have but I'm impressed with the the the whole

spectrum of different things you've done. I mean, uh the drinking water stuff, um you know, the collection systems, the demolition arrowbox. I mean, maybe we suggest to the uh town administrator that they expand this out a little bit so we can get better better background data on our people because I mean this is a tremendous amount of experience.

Um, I also know you were involved with the work with the Buzzards Bay action committee for many years. You were the representative for the city on that.

Yeah.

Again, an entity that did some fairly good things. And I think the most important thing is we talked about things, you know, as a as a whole community of towns versus all being in our own little silos, you know, of being a town or a city. And I thought, you know, the input she had, especially the stuff I remember distinctly with CL Cove and the cleanup of Clax Cove and the

ability to get um shellfishing back in Clax Cove, which was a livelihood for many New Bedford and Dartmouth residents. So I commend you for that.

I think one of the one of the things that uh reasons we had all the different experience in the city is that if it's something unusual that you know where did it go it came to our department then it's uh you know you the team took care of it or there was something that hey go see what you can find out and take care of it and I became responsible for the

crossing gates on the the train tracks down in Herman Melville Boulevard and uh the also the final working with the u uh site engineer for the contamination in the rail yard trying to get the final paperwork signed off on that and um you know again anything that came in the door and somebody had to take care of it you know somebody at the top department did so and that's kept it interesting

too you know I also had a grade four water license, water treatment plant operator's license, collection system license, and a voluntary license for uh lab or certification for the laboratory technician from the New England Waterworks.

So when you were at GHR, was it Garcia, Hanick, and Richards?

Uh principles?

No, it was Dick De Benedictus. Wow.

Uh Rich Ray.

Okay. So the second generation. Yes. No.

Okay.

you mentioned um problems at the wastewater treatment facility startup and the uh public taking notice and raising cane I guess is the way to put it. Um, that raises an interesting question of how do you view or how do you describe success for a public works department? What does that look like?

Well, the first thing obviously there was a problem there. There was we had odor issues and noise issues. Um, and I always felt that that this that the city and and myself being the the representative there had a responsibility to the neighbors to do, you know, provide them with, you know, no baloney. This is what's going on. Uh, not trying to hide anything. You know, I can hear the the this two big stacks

that sound like jet engines. So, you know, it's uh it's an issue that needs to be solved. Uh and same with the odor issues when they occur. Um and [clears throat] we we looked at all sorts of different ways to solve odor.

We brought in specialists that that just did odor studies, you know, they wrote uh books on it on odor and and that um worked, you know, again with the neighbors would be awfully upset when there was an issue and there was a couple of neighbors that, you know, were very outspoken and you had to be right sitting in front of them. Uh and also with a I I also had to sit in front of

the group of people from Lakeville during that period when we had uh two big I think it was six inch storms in a matter of a month and people's homes were flooded and uh I got to sit up front and take the you know why can't I open a hydrant and get rid of the water you know and uh it was wasn't pleasant being up there but again we we from

there we formed a a region group that still meets on uh on a quarterly basis to uh just ensure that there's communication uh between the groups, between the towns uh and that we continue to do what we had had set up as far as monitoring the the heights of the ponds, monitoring the the the dam levels and and releasing water as as needed or obviously you had to play that fine line

of trying to maintain enough water in case there's a drought in the summer, but also releasing enough so that people's homes weren't going to get flooded or if they if you got that type of event again, um people's homes are going to get flooded again. You know, it's it's like all the big storms that are coming through down south, the flash floods and that you have no control over

it. But we tried to set things up so that'd be enough control uh or control as much as we could and you know keep everyone aware where where we were standing and why we were doing certain things as far as maintaining different heights of the ponds. Um worked with the neighbors up there when it was time for the solar panels. [clears throat] So I I had to tell them that there's two things

that are on the going to happen. one definitely is this 10 acres of dead trees I'm going to cut down. So know that's going to happen but site is also being looked at for the potential for solar panels. And when we kind of got their buy in on that and I followed that program through uh you know the town and uh all the companies involved with uh you know putting that that up there as

well. Um, [clears throat] it made sure there was enough room up there for another septic system if we had to do it. Um, we brought gas into the facility, got rid of our underground storage tanks. Um, that's all been upgraded now to new new boilers, new um, new generator, whole new electrical system up there since I left. Um but uh and the [clears throat] being involved at the treatment plant uh with

the studies for u the long-term uh uh cso program that's going that's going on. It's been a we were involved I was involved in like the the reviewing all the documents and getting that together and and now I see it's you know a lot of it's been implemented with new pump stations uh new uh piping conditions and and the separation of storm water and snow water in different areas of the city. So that's ongoing as well.

So it sounds to me like you were involved in uh climate resilience, environmental sustainability, regulatory cl compliance before all those had names.

Yeah. Yeah.

Well, I I used to say that I thought that the guys that set up the water departments 100 years ago were the first conservationists.

you know, think of the people that involved in New Bedford that managed to purchase 3,000 acres of property around the ponds and get the the rice in the water. You know, it's certainly our responsibility to protect it, you know.

do relative to wastewater.

Um, as you know and the folks in New Bedford know, wastewater treatment improvements are extremely expensive and in the economy that we're in now, it's not even it's beyond that. It's dramatic. Uh, you're looking at construction costs now that used to be $250 a square foot, now north of $900 a square foot.

um rate payers are going to have to pay for that. And uh so as a board we've got some major challenges and we've got challenges relative to producing enough drinking water for the residents and for these new uh apartments that are coming online. So, it will be a challenging period for this board. And uh I think we're very lucky that the select board in the town meeting decided to make the board five members

because we're going to have to put some hard time and hard minds together to make some decisions and then share those ideas with the public so they fully understand what the implications are.

uh our superintendent has been doing a very good job of advising the zoning board of appeals [snorts] on what the implications are relative to both wastewater and drinking water, but we're sort of in a predicament in that a fair number of these projects are the 40B projects and uh hen appeals court uh is very restrictive on you know communities that say no to 40bs.

And then what happens is the community loses the control of the 40B and uh HAC takes over. So I've lived in Dartmouth since 1972.

Uh I went to SMU, which are a little older than me. I graduated in 79. Um so I've seen a lot and I've gained a lot of familiarity with the years that I worked here, the 28 years that I was here.

Um, I think the biggest thing is that we need individuals who have what I call the fire in the belly to address the problems. I think of the old days when Manny Branco, you know, was on the board and I mean was the superintendent.

Um, he was a good communicator and he worked very hard with the board to do different things because that plant's been through a number of upgrades.

um and he was very good at being able to find the money to to help out to lessen it. And we're going to have those challenges ahead of us. So, um it's going to be a busy job. Uh we meet now once a month, but we're spending anywhere between two and two and a half hours of some very intense discussions and briefings and actions and votes.

I've seen a lot of boards over my 40 years, but I can tell you no board that I'm familiar with [clears throat] has so many deliberations and so many things that they have to think through and make some big decisions and it costs money.

So, um I think your experience with the city, you probably have a very good handle on, you know, how things can, you know, can cost and what it takes, you know, the fortitude to make the hard decisions.

Jimmy, do you have any questions of the board?

Uh I had just general thinking you like how I don't even know how many employees the total number of employees but uh public works and u we're about 80 80 and [clears throat] um I I knew the you know the issues of the wastewater might be coming up was come is coming up as far as the age of the plant and upgrades. Has uh EPA been involved as far as what you you know

what your discharge limits may you have to be? Are you going to need to do uh nitrogen removal? Uh so currently uh that there aren't we don't have nitrogen limits. Um but we we we expect them to be coming down. Um, so we are working on an upgrade uh that includes some nitrogen reduction. Uh, we're just looking for funding for that currently. [clears throat] Well, uh, you're do you have the

capacity for the upcoming uh, all the new construction, you know, tank size and that or do you have to add tankage?

So in in our flow and loading study um it shows that the with all of them coming online at our treatment facility that'll put us at or above the 80% threshold with times probably over 100%.

Um and but infrastructure-wise in the collection system and pump stations um a number of the the infrastructure and pump stations will need to be upgraded for each uh development that comes in because they weren't designed for that type of flow.

Right. Right. So, u I noticed the other day in the paper there was a listing of the beach closes and I thought it was interesting that the Bedford beaches are open but clocks uh with Dartmouth and Clarks Co are closed because there was a cso and uh overflow or event and I know it's been you know 12 years or more but whenever there was a Cso event we shut down for a period if I'm

we would shut down based on the size of a rain event.

Right. Right.

And then open it pending testing.

Yeah.

And and that was beaches. No, that was not beaches. That was shellfishing.

Shellfish.

Shellfishing.

Yeah.

Beaches where they would they would they would test.

Yeah. Beaches they test frequently because I was just curious why they could be open and maybe they tested soon after. and you're just waiting a prescribed amount of time or the health department's waiting a prescribed amount of time to open them up.

Jones Jones Park was on the closure list that I saw today. But the thing is with Round Hill, Round Hill is, you know, way beyond Salt's Point around the corner as they would say. the one at uh round hill was Moses Creek and that's that's been a prevailing problem because the water warms up in that creek so much and kids love used to love to swim in there but um generally my recollection

is that Round Hill didn't see much closure. No, no, wrong. Yeah, it was more the the ones that I noticed was the in questioning is why why some of the ones in co Anthony Beach and you know why are they closed across the side is open. So might be the prevailing southeast out of that area. Yeah. [clears throat] But u I'm pretty familiar with you know you know what goes on in the public works

department. Obviously, we've u we did our own maintenance or our guys did maintenance. So, you're you know involved in a little of that. I I learned a lot of mechanical maintenance at the primary plant when uh you finish up with your lab work and you go see what the mechanics were working on and increase your knowledge there. So, um, uh, I also did a number of different, uh, presentations like at New England

Waterworks, uh, New England, uh, water pollution control. I think I did Left Tech a time or two. I know Ronn's done a few. Uh, I did the public education for the fluoride uh, edition that we we started years ago.

um [clears throat] and don't have a don't have a problem, you know, getting up and explaining what's going on, you know, to a you know, a group if if necessary, you know, that sort of thing. So, u you have a lot of experience [clears throat] with the public works side of things.

There's a [clears throat] responsibility that the board has for policym and and u providing direction but all of us including you have experience in the trenches if you will.

Yes.

How do you um view the relationship between the board and the professional staff at public works?

I think you you you must have set some expectations for the for the department to meet our goals. Um along with, you know, the goals of what you want to see their all the employees meeting along the way, you know, whether it's the trash pickup or snow removal, which is you'll never win that one.

Um [clears throat] but you know I always told my people's act professional you know it is a profession there was when I first started uh if you messed up on the back of a garbage truck you got sent down to the wastewater plant and it's been it's changed you know it's it's now a profession and I try to encourage people you know young kids that kind of don't

know what they want to do is a good got a water license got a waste water license and I I would encourage the the board or or or yourself to uh look for the individual or a couple individuals in the in the the department that you could send off to school. Uh we found that a there's not a lot of people out there with licenses. They're harder to get now particularly in the wateride

because you have to take the training prior to it uh taking the the exams. Uh, but it's nice to have some people on your bench because soon as someone gets to a position where they're [clears throat] they've moved up high enough in the ranks and they well I'm assistant at the plant. Oh jeez, they need a a director over here, you know, and they they're going to scoot, you know, and it's the money's a little bit

better or whatever. Uh the grass isn't always necessarily greener, but uh the fact that there's so few people uh with the the the experience and the licensing that they can move around easily if there if they're qualified and so inclined to do that. Um and you know build just building your bench, you know, having the qualified people available is you know we found pretty difficult for a while. Uh we didn't get

a a wastewater superintendent for a number of years and [clears throat] one of the couple of guys joked that the our department was the only department that had the water superintendent's office was at the wastewater plant and [clears throat] everything in between. So u so again we we just wore whatever hat we had to put on that day and sometimes you had three hats on or four hats on in in one day. So

absolutely and we have we have a a great you know licensing and certification program that will help assist anybody any of our employees to to move forward and get their licenses you know that's good which is great.

We also I also spoken at at uh vocational schools in the area with a mass dot apprentichip pro program to try to influence uh students to to look at water treatment and wastewater treatment licenses as well as you know hoisting and CDL and all that as well.

You know, it's that's a great opportunity for for for kids that don't know exactly where they fit into, you know they they might not want to be a plumber, but they, you know, here's some something related and uh they don't necessarily have to be out there digging the ditch, you know.

Absolutely.

Board members, any other final questions?

Informative.

Is there anything you'd like to share with us that we may have if I not you know once the for years I've kind of said so the board might be an interesting to do at some point and when it got expanded I kept thinking I should do that I should you know I should give back to the town you know I've got the background uh and [clears throat] then you know Ronnie called me up and said

that uh my name was being banted around so I found out who started did that. And that was that was my uh son-in-law's father, Jim Matthysse. Uh he mentioned it to somebody who mentioned it to you and here I am. So, but you know, I look forward to it. It's uh Jim's a great guy.

Yeah. His work he does with the Dennis Center.

Oh, he just retired last week.

Did he?

Yeah. He's all done.

Yeah. Over the years, he did a lot for Dartmouth. Boy, great people. Great people. Yeah. So that's your son-in-law?

Yeah. Uh yeah, Jeff Jeffrey is uh his oldest son is my son-in-law.

Yeah.

Cool.

Well, you see Jim, tell him I said hi. I haven't seen him in a long time.

I just want to ask, are you comfortable with uh remote meetings? Okay, good.

Because sometimes we we hold a lot, you know, since since co we've held most of our meetings through Zoom 7:30. I may still be in my jammies, but I'll uh Right. I just throw on a chair over it.

You'll be fine. And then uh and then sometimes we also try to meet in person.

Sure.

[clears throat] Okay. Thank you for your time. We appreciate it.

Thank you.

Nice to see you very much. Thank you.

Appreciate it.

Thank you very much. Pleasure.

Nice to see you, Joe.

Yeah. Thank you.

Yeah. Thanks.

Thank you.

So one thing before we uh adjourn um with new members on the board uh I think we should develop some subcommittees. So, I'd like to suggest we all think about some of the handful of topics that we want to talk about and would encourage people, the members of the board to get involved with. I think it makes sense because you can, you know, with with Tim and his team, you could have, you know, couple of

individuals, you know, drill down on some stuff and because I mean, let's let's face it, the formidable tasks that are ahead, you're going to need I I think, you know, we ought to talk about, you know, the frequency of our meetings and also, you know, whether or not we do meetings specifically on subjects. So that you know a particular thing we we probably spend an hour an hour and a half you

know really getting in depth.

Yeah.

You know on that um versus you know a you know an agenda of stuff that you know keeps the operation running. We we're going to have to really do some drilling down.

I I think I agree. And it's also an opportunity to if it's um a workshop type format to try and draw the public in as as part of our need to educate people uh on what their what their services are going to demand in the future. So I I think is a good example on that is what are we going to put together for uh some kind of group on the CWMP

because um if I've learned anything by some other towns that are in the Buzz Bay wershed the sooner you get their input and their involvement and what directions you know they're looking at the better. I think some of the municipalities didn't do that and it has resulted in you know some some you know some push back and um I think that also includes some organizations that you know have environmental responsibilities

that you know are going to want to be heard and the sooner we know those things I mean just that thing that gentleman brought up about the nitrogen you know I wasn't aware that you didn't have a nitrogen uh limit at present but I am aware that you know you or you at one time had the UV light you know um treatment system I don't know if you still have that

you do you do um but I can tell you what articles I have read in my travels the issue of nitrogen and heavy metals is definitely something that is going to be have to be addressed in that CWNP Okay, Ron, anything else?

No, I'm good.

I will entertain a motion to adjurnn.

Motion to adjurnn.

I second that motion.

Motion's been made to adjurnn and seconded. Um, Ron, yes.

Mike, yes.

Chair votes yes.

What time did we get done? The meeting's adjourned.

3:15.