Finance Committee Meeting - March 12, 2026

Well, it does work well. I'd like to call the finance committee meeting of March 12th to order. Uh, please join me for the pledge of allegiance.

I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

Please note that this meeting is in person and is being recorded.

So, we're kicking off our budget discussion again.

Uh, yes. So, uh, well, tonight, uh, I figured, uh, we had, um, usually talked to the library on, uh, on in p in the past. Now, if you remember when we go through the budget process, I usually ask departments if they'd like to, um, come to the finance committee, and I think it's advantageous for a department like the library, who's a large department within the town. So, we asked

Dena to uh, it's kind of on short notice to come here and uh, speak on her programs that are going on at the library. But I think it's good to showcase it and just have um discussion with the library and some of the trustees that are here. So Dina, so yes, our special guest, the director of the libraries and two members of the trustee board. Welcome.

Yes. Thank you trustees for being here and thank you Gary for the invite. I'm Dana St. Pierre, director of Dartmouth Public Library. Um and I'm here tonight to talk about the library.

Next please.

Thank you. So, our mission and vision statements drive what we do at the library. We aim to give the community what they want and need to thrive. We live in a challenging world, as we all know. And the library is really a place for everyone. We believe we offer something for everyone and we work for everyone every day. That's what we're driven to do. And so our mission um is dedicated to excuse me to delivering

high quality experiences including learning, cultural and personal enjoyment for everyone. And then our vision, next slide please, is that the library aims to spark curiosity and unite the community by establishing itself as a vibrant hub for innovation, digital exploration, and collaborative learning. And we aim for that every day.

Um some of the slides um in the presentation will be familiar to the finance committee because they were shared in the library's FY27 budget packet. Uh this is our door count. I like to say that people love to visit Dartmouth Public Library and when I'm talking about Dartmouth Public Library, I'm talking about Southworth Library and also North Branch Library. So these are the numbers combined for both. Uh door

count has steadily increased every fiscal year coming off of COVID. That's a very good thing because even five years ago we weren't sure how we were going to wind up um after coming out of co um people are coming into our physical space not just to borrow material. Uh they attend free library sponsored programs or friends of the libraries uh events. Nonprofit groups hold meetings. Town groups hold

meetings. Uh people come to have a document notorized or to apply for a passport. Uh people come to use the computers or just simply to print something. Some come for a quiet space um and others come because it's a safe place to just be and uh people also visit for the community aspect of it. So next slide please. I'd love to say that Dartmouth Public Library card holders love to borrow physical material. Every

chance I get, I let people know that Dartmouth is the highest circulating library for physical material in the sales network. That's one of the reasons why I applied for my job three years ago. I wanted to come and be a part of this. Um there are over 70 libraries in the sales network. Uh when someone tells you that kids don't read or that no one uses the library anymore, they're

extremely misinformed. Our circulation has increased every year since FY22 and we expect that to continue. We're not where we were before CO. Um, but we're steadily getting back up there and that's a huge point of pride for me.

Next slide, please. Um, we love that people borrow digitally and that our digital resources are so well utilized.

Um, they're not the same numbers that we see with physical material, but the numbers are getting closer every year.

Between FY22 and FY25, there was a 54% increase in digital borrows with the largest increase between 23 and 24. And I came in May of 23. So, I'm trying to toot my own horn, but I am a little bit a little bit for that because I do take a lot of pride in this. Um, with four months to go to FY26, we are on track to surpass last year's total by the

beginning of May. People should not think that just because they borrow material online that they're not using the library. We hear that some like they'll apologize like, "Oh, but I'm I'm reading it on my phone." And they like feel bad, but they're very much using the library when they borrow digitally through us. We work very hard to cultivate the digital collection um to best benefit the community the same way

we do with physical materials. Um, and this chart only reflects our top two vendors. Uh, we have over a dozen online resources available to Dartmouth Public Library card holders.

Next, uh, this kind of infographic is something that we look forward to sharing every year. I spoke about how people visit the library for many reasons. Uh, staff fulfilled 378 notary requests in 2025. That was the largest number ever. Um they processed 1,225 passport applications and over 10,000 people attended programs and this includes class visits from Potter and Kushman schools. We have an excellent

relationship with both Potter and Kushman and someday it will be the same with Quinn and Dlo. It's just logistically very hard to have the same kind of relationship.

Next, please. Uh people save money by using the library thanks to the calculator at i love libraries.org. or we've been able to calculate how much the community saves and we know the number is higher um because we're not accounting for all that we offer um on this infographic but saving at least $4 million says quite a lot as a community I think and this is one I'm going to

talk real fast we have a lot to look forward to in the coming months uh summer is always our busiest time period the summer reading will pro um launch on the last day of school June 23rd as long as that doesn't change and I really I hope it doesn't. There will be extra activities and events for all ages throughout the summer months. We just started a seed library on March 2nd.

People can stop by either library to choose a packet or two of a variety of seeds lettuce spinach chives flowers, bomb, peppers, there's all sorts of stuff. List goes on and it's just the beginning. Uh we're offering programs in support of the seed library as well. So, expect more to come, including a wildflower seed bomb workshop uh later this month. You do need to register for that at dplmma.org.

Uh we started a library of things last June. I talked about that a little a year ago when I saw um the finance committee and we've gotten a great response from the community. Giant lawn games, pickle ball equipment, gardening tools, binoculars, DVD players, Blu-ray players, CD players, a food dehydrator, a sewing machine, and more are available to borrow for free with your library card, and we're adding new material

often, and we're always open to suggestions.

We continue to grow Oh, I got one more, two more on that other slide. We continue to grow our collection. Uh we're um developing a sci-fi section by request um because right now we don't separate our sci-fi from the general fiction collection. So we're pulling out sci-fi and that's happening tonight as we speak. Uh we're looking into an adult graphic novel collection because comics

and illustrated books aren't just for kids and teens. Um within the last year we've added 139 audio enabled books for kids and families at both libraries. And as of yesterday, the total checkouts was over 3,000. Families love these books.

Kids love them, and we're very happy to have them to offer. Um, we've added binge boxes, which are DVD sets, um, that have four to five movies that support a theme, like bookstore, or action adventure, and people love to binge their programs. So, this is a way to do that with movies. And um the big thing is um the fostering connections with and within the community because like I said in the

beginning, that's what drives us. That's what we're here to do as public librarians. That's why many of us went to school and focused on public librarianship and our schooling because we believe in the value of community and what we can bring to our community. And I think our staff, our friends group, our trustees, that's what we're all there to do every day. And so I do take a lot of pride in that and I'm very

happy to be here to brag about it. So now the last slide. Thanks. But if you have any questions um I which you may or you may not and that's fine. Um but I did just want to plug two things. I just found out before I came here we're taking part in a minute madness challenge. It's a statewide reading challenge and today was the day to make it on to the bracket. So, the top 16

participating libraries in the state were going to make it on. We were pretty confident we were going to make it on.

We are in number one. I mean, we're we're first.

Um, we we logged over 250,000 minutes and that is in part thanks to Potter School because they've embraced this challenge big time. And and now that we've seen how successful that is, we have ideas for how to involve the other schools next year. um the librarian over at the middle school is also taking part. So um we're very grateful for that. But it was very exciting to see us

as the on the bracket in the top 16 in the number one spot. So fingers crossed.

Um and you can log if you read the newspaper, you listen to books, whatever, you can log your minutes at our website dplma.org.

And finally, if you're a knitter or a sewer or you're at all into fabrics, um, and Terry donated a ton of stuff for this, thank you. Um, our friends group is hosting their first fabric and fiber sale this Saturday at Southworth Library from 9:30 to 4. They set up the room today. It is unbelievable the donations we received from the community for this sale. Um, and all there's so much hard

work that's gone into this. So, if you're someone who's into that or you know someone who is, please encourage them to come spend some money at the library. It all benefits library programs. So, when is that? That's this Saturday, March 14th, 9:30 to 4 at Southworth Library.

Yeah. Phew.

Wow. Can you talk a little bit about, you know, uh, so Dino, we just had met with capital also on the, um, on the program over at, uh, Southworth on the, uh, feasibility study that they're looking to do over there. I don't know if you want to maybe touch base a little bit.

So, um, I think probably within the first five minutes of meeting town administrator Hadad, I was like, so we really need to do something about Southworth Library. Um, not rebuild Southworth Library or get a new a brand new library. Not that, but we need to renovate it. It's Southworth Library is ext I love Southworth Library. I grew up going there. It's extremely dated. And when the children's room got moved down

to the basement in the 90s, it never got repainted on the second floor. So, it's you still see the primary colors from the children's, you know, room. So, little things like that. We're talking a new rug. Stair treads need some love. We need new window treatments. They're falling apart. It's like we're the top library and we have a gorgeous building and then we have one that on our

strategic plan survey people like person after person after person were like Southworth is drab. I don't go there unless I absolutely have to like you know everyone's so nice there but it's terrible like you know like um so um town administrator Hadad and I spoke about doing a feasibility study and what that would mean and so I did make a request um on behalf of the board for $50,000 for a feasibility study. Um I

have two people from the Massachusetts Board of Library Commissioners coming down to do free consulting. I just found that out today in April. So, they can give sort of their ideas so that we kind of already have some like an a vision in place of what we would like to see happen um if we're to get the money to move forward with the study. So, thank you.

Yeah. Thank you.

You know, Dina, I've always admired your enthusiasm.

Thank you.

And I can Your enthusiasm is what has really brought the libraries to what they are today. And I always want people to realize the libraries are so much more than books.

Hey, I love books.

But you brought so many interesting programs to the libraries as well. And I'm glad that you have this opportunity now to highlight it because I hope from our thousands of viewers that are now watching that they will look and go, I should go to those libraries.

Yes.

I appreciate you're coming here.

Thank you, Janine. I appreciate that.

Yeah. And I think it's also important the collaboration that she has with the schools.

Yeah.

Um you know uh obviously like Dina said, you know, logistically some of the schools can't participate, but maybe someday someday we'd we'd love to figure out a way to make that happen. I mean we have a huge benefit in that. Um my I started my librarian career as a children's librarian. Our assistant director was a children's librarian before she was an assistant director and now sort of an

adult materials collection specialist.

Um, so we we have one children's librarian for the two libraries. She can't be in two places at once. She her office is at Southworth. But we've done a really good job, I think, over the last two and a half years or so of, you know, children's librarian works at North Branch once a week. Our assistant director works at North Branch once a week. I go to North Branch. So, we all

help out with the programs from the school and any other children's programs that are happening. Um, and so that's a big benefit I think because it's there's definitely a gap in that service and we try to fill it in by making ourselves available to help out. And our branch librarian does a great job with that as well. She's not a ch children's librarian, but but she's great. So, she's a great librarian. So, it it um

she does a great job of helping out. So, yeah.

I think it was smart when they designed the new I call it the new library, though it's probably not so new anymore.

It's still new.

Still new. um when they put that community room on there. Yes.

How they have access to it. And I say that because Joan Marie and I both belong to the uh regional camera club that meets there. It has outside access.

It's a beautiful space for those types of meetings and I'm sure for other types of meetings as well. That was a really good idea.

So great. That's a big trend in libraries um with you see that a lot with new construction and some renovations. Maybe someday if we renovate Southworth, we'd be able to figure out how to do something like that at Southworth. Maybe. Um, but it's a that's a great service to be able to offer the community is after hours access.

Yes. Agreed.

Yeah.

Questions. Terry, just did you talk about the monthly speakers?

No. Uh, the um because the online library. Yeah.

Yeah. No, no, no. Um, that's a great program. I'm glad you mentioned it.

There's um a program that the friends of the library pay for um for us um called authors live and you can it's it's not in person there when uh Freda McFaden spoke there was somebody who was very upset that it wasn't in person and I was like wow you think we got her to come here but um but it's online you don't have to watch in real time you can go wa

back and watch anything since the subscription started which was during COVID awesome series it's always bigname author authors, some authors you maybe haven't heard of, speakers from the Smithsonian. It's really a a lovely nationally program, nationally known people. Correct. And you can, if you do register, you can submit questions and they might use your question in the live interview. Um, but

like I said, it's great because if you can't tune in at six o'clock on a Thursday because that's dinner time or family time, you could go back the following afternoon and watch it on your lunch break. They're all like an hour long. That's a that's an awesome service and that's open to anybody. You don't even you don't have to log in with a library card. So we know that there are people from other libraries in the

community that are tuning in for that too which is great.

Great.

Yes.

Um just some some comments. We had met during our initial reviews and in a little informal setting and the create just to piggyback on the creativity that's offered in this library as a new person moving into the community is just really incredible and it's much more than books. Your your library at the on the north side of town UMass is right there. We talked about a lot of kids coming in from UMass and

using the library for quiet spaces away from the college campus. I talked about the dog and the excitement of the dog and seeing the dog at the library.

Therapy dog. Yeah, the therapy dog. The therapy dog, everybody.

I was wondering where you're going with the dog.

The dog.

Truly calming dog.

The calming. And I just wrote down just to how how the creativity you can feel it, you can see it. the sales website.

I'm over on Martha's Vineyard, so I'm at Oakluffs, too, with my my sales um um card. Um I loved the binge box. I love that. And I wrote down I was wondering if when the snowstorm came, did you get a lot of activity, books and libraries and movies and that's awesome. you buckle down when it's, you know, there's a storm coming. And we try to do like targeted social media posts like, oh, if

you're going out for your milk and your bread, stop by the library and get your books. And and it was great to see how many thing like games from the library of things went out for in a head of the snowstorm and and the movies. I mean, Southworth has had for years an amazing reputation for its DVD collection and prior to that its VHS collection. Um, people come from far and wide for the um, Southworth DVD

collection, but the binge boxes change because that's how a lot of people watch now is to just watch successively.

Wonderful.

And and and it's really very, you know, noticeable and appreciative. So, so thank you for what you do there. And I also uh talked a little bit, you do passports at the library.

Yes. So the town must go through some sort of certification uh in regards to the issuances of passport.

Southworth Library went through that. So it's only Southworth Library is the passport agency. We can't even if there's a passport agent who works at North Branch. We cannot do um passports at North Branch. So Southworth is the agency. I believe many many moons ago passports happened here through the town clerk's office and it was decided that had to stop because the town clerk's

office also issues birth certificates so they couldn't do both and the town administrator at the time went to my predecessor and mentioned it to her and then she said well we could take it on at the library. So it's been happening for a long time. Um, we've had the highest years the past few years and I think that's just due to how many people were getting passports after COVID and

then with the Real ID, you know, there's a lot happening with passports. We have um three agents on staff, so they all go through a very lengthy training process. They get reertified every year. Um, and yeah, they're pretty amazing. My office is on the other side of the wall from the passport room and I'm always amazed when I hear them working with people and how grateful people are that they're able to

come have an easy experience versus being in maybe a crowded, you know, you don't get taken into an office at the post office to do your application and if you have kids, there's a lot happening. Um, so it's we we hear I hear a lot of positive feedback from people through the wall.

Congratulations. It's an awesome program.

Thank you very much.

Thank you. I'd like to compliment your communication. So, you guys are great about I subscribed a while back online and the up the texting that comes out like you were talking about the author's live that I get that um and and it's really great to get that, you know, those alerts because sometimes I'll just I'll forget.

Same, right?

Yeah. The alert comes. Oh, yeah. Okay. I forgot I wanted to, you know, check into that or whatever it might be. Yeah. So, thank you for the communication.

Excellent.

It's really wonderful.

Thank you. So, I'm glad to hear that.

Thank you.

Quick question on the uh the feasibility study.

Sure.

It sounds and I listened to the capital planning meetings. It sounds like you have sort of an idea of what you'd like to see it and I know like for example like the school roof a feasibility study is part of the statutory requirement to get MSBA funding. Is that same study like why why wouldn't is it possible to sort of skip a feasibility study and go right into like sort of a schematic design to like

actually take steps towards achieving it versus just yeah there is but um and you know Dean and her staff are great but the idea would be to hire a firm that specializes in libraries and so they think of the things that we don't think of you know they get an idea of what the programming actually is um and then they have the experience of working with several libraries to recommend and something

that's conducive not just the operation now but operations in the future and there's probably a lot of things that go beyond what we can just see that probably need to get done. So for us to invest in design phase for things like Dena mentioned which will certainly be part of it um it'll probably cost us more in the long term because we're missing we could be missing a lot of

things in and how far in the future are we planning. So um this is the process that we followed with a lot of our other um facilities projects. So we've done it with the COA. Uh when there was discussions on a recreation center, he did it with a recreation center. And the idea is to take in what are the current needs and what are future needs too. So part of that could be looking at the

strategic plan, looking at uh some of the surveys and taking that all into account. Um because if we're going to make a large investment, which this likely will be to some extent, we don't want to have to do it again in five years.

Yeah. And the only thing that's going through my head is that that there are architects, designers that specialize in library design who have that same sort of knowledge and just sort of being art be able to articulate what you've already articulated as sort of the ideas and the concepts and the you know they might be able to take that and I'm not saying I'm not I'm just it's something worth

considering is there an architect we can engage that can sort of listen to the ideas the concepts and and one sort of skip a step potentially uh which would then ultimately allow us to do these types of things faster. It's I'm not asking for an answer now but just something that you can consider.

The challenge with that then becomes um you you could run into procurement issues because anything over any building project over 1.5 million we have to have an OPM in first before you engage with an engineering firm. So and this very well could be over $1.5 million. Um and so statutory reason for yeah that there's part of it statutory and then the idea would be to get options you know or even phasing plans

you know this is something you should consider now that's a million dollars cost estimates rather than getting right into that conceptual design phase um we may have to backtrack at some point anyways if it's going to be over 1.5 we'd have to backtrack pretty much right away and also I think to add to that um you know if we're getting if we're going to have a feasibility study they're also

going to probably be looking at some level of efficiency. So, they're going to come in with with hopefully a plan, a couple plans that show some efficiency in the building. Obviously, we've talked about items that need to probably be replaced more more on the short term than the long term, like with the elevator with water going into the into so there's some inefficiencies there.

Um, and usually my experience, I've been on a building committee in in in Westport, it was the architect comes in and wants, you know, crown moldings and they want to make the place look beautiful, but at the same time, they're not looking for that level of efficiency. So I think there's you know it's a small investment to maybe get to that point. Uh and also when I think when they built uh north they you know

they even had a phys feasibility study for the for the do they need a second library right?

So I mean it it's tough because we spent a lot of money on these feasibility studies but I think in the long term it's um it's an investment for the entire project.

Considering all the comments I heard the other night about the elevator I suspect that has to be looked at.

That doesn't sound cheap to fix either.

So, oh, right.

Yeah. So, this is more than just paint and correct. I'm looking at it cosmetically.

Like the the ideas I have and the vision I have is cosmetic. Somebody else needs to look at it and say, "Oh, but hey, you really need to deal with your elevator and it taking on water and being put out of commission."

You talked about space, too.

And right and the spacing is big to me.

Like I I you know when the elevator got installed in 1989 um the the main entrance was always the front of the building. When that elevator was installed, the lower level became the entrance. There are no staff sightelines to that area at all. You walk in if you're a first- timer or you're not sure where you're going. There is not a soul around for you to ask about that.

It's very confusing actually.

In my mind it is. And in my mind, I see a circulation desk there when you walk in. And I don't know how to make that happen. Like I see it and I have the idea, but is that feasible? Like is it does it make sense because what else would have to be moved? I mean like the the children's room, like I mentioned, you know, was moved into the basement and that was a genius idea actually

because the entire collection had been on the first floor. I'm this well the main floor and the basement was trustees meeting room and storage and that redesign was actually a great idea but we also got the children's room in the community room in a basement with no light like and again if you walk into North Branch which is all light and beautiful and then you walk into the community room at Southworth it's kind

of sad like it it just makes you kind of feel like you know haven't gone back to Southworth since a lot of people said that on their survey.

It was like kind of shocking when we did that. It was like, wow. Like, so much nicer space.

You know, I I I really I was really pleased when, you know, Cody mentioned about doing the feasibility study and that it was like, okay, so this is an option because, you know, we I you want to do it right and looking ahead to the future, too. And how do we continue to serve the community years out from now just uh and meet their needs? They're all looking for quiet study rooms, a

place to work, you know, because there so many people are working remotely. Our we have three study rooms at North. Most of the day those rooms are filled. You know, you get it for two hours, then you have to leave. Someone else is waiting right away to get in. This is what people are looking for.

We don't have that at Southworth. John Oh, yeah. Sorry, John.

Um, great job, Tom.

Thank you.

U, should be very proud of what you and your staff do.

Thank you. um and how important the libraries is to the community. Big takeaway for me tonight, and I've heard you you've been before us a number of times. Uh big takeaway for me that I don't recall seeing in the past was your door counts. I'm embarrassed to say I'm not a big part of those door counts. Uh but very impressive and those kind of numbers tell me, you know, the community

is going to be supporting you going forward um in your de keep up the great work because uh Thank you.

It's worthwhile.

Thank you.

I just have one quick question. In this summer, what kind of programs are you do you think that you might be offering?

So, we do summer reading programs. Um, so the summer reading program is sort of two parts. We do an incentive program for logging minutes and books read.

Actually, we don't do the minutes anymore. We do a g because not all kids can read as fast as other kids. And as an adult who reads very slowly, the minutes is a lot of pressure. But we do there's like a little board game sheet that our children's librarian creates and you just have to like complete the tasks to get on to the next. So, it's read under a tree, you know, read read

at the beach, bring your book to your grandparents house, stuff like that's very attainable. And then they bring the sheets in and each week we we pick winners from both libraries and they get to pick a prize. The prizes are all sponsored by the friends of Dartmouth Libraries. So, it's no cost um to the library. Um and that happens every week for six weeks. And then in addition to

that, there's the the more events. So, like every Tuesday there will be an event at Southworth at 1 PM and over at North Branch at 4 PM. We're adjusting the times for the last day of school because originally it was June 11th and June 23rd seemed like a great day to launch the summer reading program. So, um anyway, um so like the first week it's a puppet show and you can see it at one at at

North uh Southworth or four at North Branch. then it's a magician, there's a musician coming one week, there's an acrobat coming. So each it's like an exciting program. Um our children's librarian off also offers a craft program at both libraries once a week.

So she'll do it on Mondays at North, Wednesdays at South. She does her traditional baby songs. Well, actually she doesn't do baby songs in the summer.

She just does story time. So she'll do storytime programs at both libraries. We show movies during the summer. So like almost every weekday there's some activity happening at either library that you can take part in.

But you can also rent a machine, a karaoke machine.

You can rent a karaoke machine.

Who doesn't love cornhole? But store corn right out of the north library. You have a cornhole.

Me I don't have a place to It's amazing. Go online and see what you can grab. It's just amazing.

And we're adding more of those things before summer. Um, but there's stuff happening all the time. And then for teens and adults, we do a prize cart.

You just have to show up at the library.

You don't even have to read you because we have a lot of people who come in not just for books or to borrow material.

You just scratch a ticket. It says either you're an instant winner or you get to um and you get to pick a prize from the prize cart or you get entered into the grand finale raffle. So people can scratch tickets once a week. People love that. Just makes it a little fun at the desk. And then they get to pick, you know, a donated book or a gift card that the friends have purchased. And then

we'll also do programs. We haven't booked them yet, but we'll do programs for teens and adults that are more summer focused. The theme, the national theme this year is plant a seed, read. I think that's what it is. So, it's perfect timing with our seed library also because we're going to, I think, focus programs on that. So, it's a lot of fun stuff and discounts to a lot of local museum.

Yes. Oh, that's right. I didn't even talk about the museum passes. Free or discounted passes to museums, you know, locally in Boston. So, you take the train to Boston, you go to New England Aquarium. I mean, there's, you know, you get a discounted price. Who doesn't like that? Free admission to Buttonwood Park.

I mean, it's really there's so much to take advantage of really. And it's to everyone's benefit because like I said, we live in very challenging times. And I don't need to tell the finance committee that we live individually and collectively in challenging financial times. So why not take advantage? So your door counts are now going to soar after I hope so.

They do. I hope they do.

So that's why when Gary asked I was like of course I'll yes I'll be there. Like just a little bit of notice. Sure.

Thank you very much. Any other questions or comments for Dina?

I appreciate everyone's feedback and for taking the time.

Thank you so much.

Thank you trustees for joining us.

Yes. Thank you very much. They were on my hiring committee. They they support and all the trustees are supportive.

These two especially are very supportive. We're very happy with the library.

Yes.

It's awesome.

Thank you very much. Enjoy your evening.

Nice to see you. Nice.

So, uh, next, Madam Chair, on the, um, on the agenda, I had put this on there and I sent out the draft. I sent out the actually the final from last, um, last, uh, town meeting. I just wanted, uh, the committee to start looking at that and maybe get some ideas. I know it's still early. We obviously don't have the uh, final budget yet. U,, but just maybe to

I know Brian had put a lot of uh, uh, data for the graphs. Um, we could probably use some of that information again this year, but obviously I have to update that. Uh, and then some verbiage in there. I don't know. I think last year, Terry, if maybe um, didn't weren't there sections that people worked on, I believe on the letter sections. Weren't there sections that people worked on on the letter?

Oh, yeah. Yeah, they were they were dealt out. I was going to suggest that we add some, you know, the um, perfect swarm.

Yes.

To add some good something concise to say that it's not just us.

Yeah. Oh, or or you could also put um the link of the link.

Well, yes. I mean, we we offer that on the website now, of course. Um but yeah, there's some data in there for sure, but you're right. It's not just us. And that's actually because I was thinking about how to address this. And that's definitely something that should be in the letter is that it's affecting everyone, not just Dart.

So, obviously, it's a little early. I mean uh to start maybe even compiling it, but I just wanted the committee to maybe start thinking about what they would want in that. Um obviously we talked about the revenues. We've talked about um you know the expenses escalating at a certain percentage rate and I think a lot of the well a lot of the graphs that we had put in there were from the do division of local services.

So yeah, we could probably start working on that.

I worked with Brian on some of those last year to include uh and I I mean I don't know who's going to be the point person for the the information. I don't know if it' probably be be between myself and Carrie.

Okay.

Yeah.

So, what I what I would suggest maybe some ideas that you would shoot to you can give them to me and I can forward them to to to Janine or or Carrie on what you want to see in there.

Uh then um once we you can contact me directly. It's Yeah. Once we start once we start um compiling compiling it, we have like one draft that we're all submitting information.

Yeah. I looked at the uh charts and graphs today and that was something I was thinking, okay, do we want the same ones? Of course, some are the same. I don't mean the content stays the same. I mean what it is stays the same. Um is there something new we need to add to that graph lineup? I don't want three pages of them, but you know, does something need to be replaced with something else? I guess

that's just food for thought to keep it fresh. You talked about this and I don't know if you did it but did was there money put into the budget to this was very expensive letter right you said that the printing of it was oh we printed this in house I was going to say it was on a copy machine in the office here I believe we printed we printed this in house uh in the cler

I thought you said it was very expensive the charter that we had to send out I don't know if that's what you think of that was very expensive because we had to send out the charter changes last year that cost us like $15,000 yeah this is roughly around all all said and done with poses and everything, we're like $300.

So, it's included in the admin administrative budget.

Well, I I think I paid for it out of my budget, so it wasn't really Okay.

Because the finance committee budget, we really don't postage. This year, I'm going to charge though for folding and stuffing those envelopes.

Yeah. So, um you know, the time frame is usually the committee likes to get it out before the packet goes out. So, they have that in hand and they're reading it. Um, so if we back the date, we're looking at probably beginning of May.

Okay.

Um, okay.

Have to send it out in the beginning of May or Well, town meetings June uh June 2nd.

We want to be before the mailing that the town clerk does. And what is that?

10 days before she Cody, you must at least two weeks before.

Two weeks before that she has to mail the regular packet. Yes.

And we want to be before that because Right. Yeah.

We're hoping that they open that with excitement before they get the big envelope.

Yeah. So I mean packets go to all town meeting members just town meeting members.

That's who it gets directly mailed to.

We post it online for anybody. Okay.

But it gets directly mailed to town meeting members.

And just as a note if you're not a town meeting member though deer might not be because she's not. So you Brian you're not a town meeting because I remember you commented you don't get the packet.

That's a Could I ask a follow-up question or help write it so I know what's in it. I don't need to say that's true, but I'll just say it's goes to tell me.

I know in the north end that um there's lots of open slots and people have That's what I was going to say.

Uh join just by writing your name in.

I don't know where you live, but you could trickier.

I'm out of luck. I'm in nine. I'm eight and nine. It's a little tighter.

You guys are tighter.

So, so, so, so I'm just um Could I speak out loud? Would you mind? Um a few minutes.

No, no, speak out loud. Town meeting is on June 2nd and it's an all day event.

Yes.

Okay.

Scheduled for all day, but scheduled for all day, but you know, it could get ruckus. It could go all day.

No, it usually fills the day for that.

I would say it should fill the day. It should fill the day hopefully. Um, and I'm a town I'm not a town meeting member, but I'm a finance committee member. But I go to town meeting, but I'm on stage and I don't have to speak for the entire day.

Well, you're on stage. That's correct.

Vote. Oh, no. You're not. I'm not. I I I I do what?

So, but that's okay. I were talking when we came in that she's been in many districts okay that have not been representative districts. went to over 40 town meetings and not one.

They're open town.

So that's something pretty special. I usually you should see, you know, but I could You're going to have to put tape over my mouth. Can you imagine?

But I'll figure that out. But it is interesting to me.

Our meeting is wellun.

Is it funny?

You have to be invited to He has to be invited to speak.

She does. That's what keeps a tight tight range because because there are some people who speak all the time.

Okay.

Just curious.

She tries to make sure it rotates.

She's a really She does a great job.

You can add your input. You just you just can't vote.

I've been watching everything. I want to speak.

Yeah. No, you're allowed to speak.

You really I want to speak.

You should start a blog.

I look at my efforts following you. You should start a blog.

So, we'll get back to the just look at you know this is some of the graphs that we had last year. population I think was important. Brian DJ done this uh and um you know there's so we talked about we put the uh capita income uh income graph in there uh new growth that's an important graph um state aid another important graph we should probably include for this year so um and then we did the summary

right so there are some key points I think that obviously probably the same or and then different we need to add I want to make sure it's new I hate to see look like it's a rehash.

Okay.

Some challenges, area, regional challenges.

I think challenges. I think you also want to highlight some areas su of success because you know some of the things that we've done this year, we're not just sitting around acknowledging there's a problem and not doing anything. We've looked at health insurance. We established a budget advisory group.

We're going out to bid or or looking at the market for our property casualty liability insurance. Like there's areas we're not just sitting around. And so that's important. you know that but it's important I think to share depressing letters you make right I won't write a depressing letter can we stop like thinking about some I like this like we should have positive and then what we're working on like yeah

talking the whole point is obviously I'm not writing the letter tonight but it's just to get topics ideas and to think about that you know hey you know I think we should add this send it to me I we can start a folder that's what we did last year on topics and then we can build that into the uh into the letter so that uh we have timely topics in there like Cody said we

you know, some of the successes that we've had over over the year. Um, and that's good to highlight. I mean, the town needs to know.

People need to hear that. They don't all follow everything everybody's doing in town. So, they need to hear the positive things as well.

Um, and as I said before, keep in mind if there's some new type of chart that we need to include that might be different.

If you didn't include chapter 70, that may be something to consider.

Chapter 70.

Yeah. Not just state aid, but chapter 70 in particular, because I mean, state aid's fallen behind, but chapter 70 is a big area.

Correct. Um, that's a good idea. That's that's our biggest, you know, concern is is the school budget. Obviously, no, people need to get if you put it out to the town meeting, there could be um many people calling the representatives and saying, "Can we amend it? Can we, you know, no, ideally, you're right. It spurs them on to say, can this be changed at the state level, which we all say we know

there's issues that need to be changed at the state level."

Where do you get information on chapter 70s?

Yeah. DLS.

Yeah. It's still on the same thing. Yep.

Oh yeah.

Yeah. They they they have the charts all on there and you can do community comparison reports. One of the things we should look at is we should have um at least a draft of our uh budget portal prior to you finishing this um budget portal.

And that actually will have a lot of these graphs in built in. And so we we may take a meeting and we'll share it with you ahead of time. you look through and if there's things in particular that we want to throw pull from there, don't don't reinvent the wheel. Like we do pull from DLS, let's pull from our own data and then you can reference it back.

Well, it highlights the fact that this now exists, right? Yeah. And that's I think it's important too like um just as Cody mentioned with the um with DLS to highlight that because it's really where I mean DS uh with uh schools, it's important to highlight that to show that break that out of the chapter break that out of the state aid money and show that how flat that's been over the last

because we can do that. we can show just chapter 70 and how that hasn't grown in the last 10 years amongst the others but maybe have a section of this report that shows here you know we're concerned with chapter 70 here's where it hasn't gone in the last 10 years you know hasn't even kept up with inflation we've talked about that before so these are all ideas I think we have to start thinking of

early on we need to start do that that's because why we're talking about it now I follow up on that I think it's brilliant to talk about for example here is where we are suffering education aid via chapter 70 and the 29 elements and all of that other silliness that was established way back when that you could do a white paper on that no one reads right so 1980s 1980s and when you test I've testified

before the said this is going to take so much courage for you to get in there and they it just so so that's perfect um chapter 91 funds you know we're g we're the largest you know is there you know you know that infrastructure stuff bridges you know uh we we we are a minimum aid community and what does that mean and education aid and so the next state uh funding is going to oh what's

education aid minimum age community let's go to quite frankly your urbans and things like that so we can do the same thing with chapter 90 put a section here that's called roads and infrastructure show chapter 90 flat for the next few years. So we can have sections of this really.

So it really highlights what we're not getting.

Exactly. You know, we you know, we we think we should be anticipating what is not coming to Dartmouth.

Push to school choice. I mean, you know, school choice for 5,500 instead of 5 thou, you know, that hasn't changed. So, you know, it's quite brilliant to say we're on this. We're looking at it.

We're frustrated as you are, but we can't not address it in some manner, shape, or form. you know, it highlights the real big pieces of our state aid, chapter 90 and chapter 70s uh funds. I mean, that's really where it comes comes from.

Can I just give a little background?

It's not directly related, but in 1993, the cities of Brockton and Worcester sued the state because they said that um their kids didn't get the same education as everybody else.

After a long period of time, obviously, this formula was put into place. Now, I don't know if it's even been updated, but it's inadequate. The gateway cities need the money. They absolutely do.

There's no question. But the towns also need and the the graph from that report was very understandable.

So 1990 93, the formula has not changed.

No, no val Oh, I can't speak anymore. No variable within the funding formula for chapter 70 has changed in any manner, shape, or form, including the costs of health insurance and the cost of special education. So what they did is because everybody's screaming and yelling is, "All right, we'll give you $10 per pupil in additional aid." And so when you see your foundation, you see additional

student aid, and it was like $10 in in 19, you know, whatever. And so that is the only way that they're moving per pupil money into education aid is by that $10 which is now $75,000 $75,000.

Yes. $75. And typically we're out of the Senate. You get more money in June. But this year you're looking at 9C cuts potentially in April, but that's only going to be on your fourth quarter. And on 115 your fourth quarter is not going to be able to do too much. But still um so all of these variables are just like closing the door. We just have to figure out what is going to be relevant for

town meeting members and we can get we can get into a thing where we we're talking with jargon and you know stuff that you don't want want you don't want to go too much dark on because I just want I just wanted you to know where this formula came from and and what the premise is they are not the state is not meeting the law on this or on special education.

The law says what they should be funding.

Unfortunately, it's allocated money. So, at the end of the law, if allocated, subject to appropriation, the three famous words in every legislation, appropriate, I'm sorry. Yeah.

Subject to appropriation. We will and therefore, and we believe, subject to appropriation will do it.

But if the Senate heard from a lot of people, that could make a difference.

Yeah.

Sorry. Yes. Just in terms of the letter, just some structural comments just running through my head right now is we should try to dumb it down. Not dumb it down. We should try to simplify it as much as possible. Um I think heard that before, right, Terry?

You did honestly. No, I I'm saying we should simplify it even more like bulleted lists type of stuff and and then we can elaborate like I think the cover page needs to just be something that anyone can read and understand and grasp you know what are the the highlights what are the key successes this year and what are the key challenges this year. We can elaborate more in the back, but the

reality is that many people will look at page one.

Oh yeah.

Skim it.

Paragraph one.

And and if we can make our page one skimable and be able to ingest a lot of information, it will be more effective.

We can include all the graphs and all the the detail in the back.

But the meat of our of our what we want to communicate should be very simple on page one, simple terms.

And then you know we can reference you know see page four for graph highlighting this or whatever you know just some way to to make it relatable to to the people to our audience.

No it's a good idea I do say just this one's seven pages it cannot be longer than seven pages.

No it should honestly ideally just because of copying purposes it should be six.

I I'm with you on this.

I'm trying to save some money. No, but I I agree with you be because truly once you start getting over three or four pages, nobody reads the whole thing.

So, I think six really should be a good goal to stop at.

I don't think I think some people will will appreciate like me, I I would appreciate a lot of data.

Um but uh uh an executive summary of some sort that really distills down the key points of what is in the body of the document.

Yeah, I think I think um there's no magic to the number of pages. You want to peique their interest off the first page and you want to get them you want to get them interested in going to one of those bullet points maybe and going and looking to say okay want to know more about why chapter 70 is is you know stagnant for the last 10 years or I want

to know about the success of the health insurance screen steering committee and what that's brought. I think that's maybe you know maybe we changed the format a little bit. I think that maybe I think that's a good idea pretty good idea.

Yeahum I like the intro bulleted like that.

different different um content.

It would be helpful to send it to others outside of the time if it's in a new format and it's exciting and this is what we've achieved and this is where we're going and here's some pictures and graphs and data and we send it to town meeting members. Does it make sense to send to the board chairs of our boards and commissions?

Oh, we didn't talk about that. It would be too expensive to send to everybody.

But it's available online.

Oh, I know. I know. But think about it.

Think about where we're going with underrides, overrides, and debt exclusions and and and the community as a whole and our board chairs leading their individual boards and departments.

That'd be kind of cool to receive from the Fincom. Oh, look. because I think if I understood correctly, we had some communication issues with some boards and now we have a budget advisory committee group. I'd send it to them.

Um, if we opened up the letter in communication, does that achieve anything for us? I think you send it to union chairs, the bargaining units.

When Buddy did that um uh summary of CPC because they were getting pressure, you know, what what do we do? It was very impressive and I think that I think it would make a difference. Sandra, that's a good idea.

Good.

I have to just I again obviously we're going to keep this on we'll have this on the agenda uh in future meetings so that we can start working on it as far as in the draft form once we start getting close to finishing the budget.

So um Janine, I appreciate you moving us along. I do.

It's great. got he's running a tight ship this season.

Just some food for thought for the committee.

You know, we can continue to, lack of a better word, about how we're being treated by the state and how everything is flatlined.

I think most people know that and I'm not opposed to showing that and pointed that out. Um, we need to but and everybody knows and we certainly know the train is heading for a wreck.

We're going to fall off the cliff or hit the wall.

Yeah.

What are we doing about it? What are we proposing? I rather focus. Show them this is what's happened. show them. You know, Brian had some uh great information at the last meeting on what the town is uh how much the town's budget is going up and how the school department's budget is going up and that train wreck with them splitting apart.

Um and it shows that we have been trying to make attempt to fund, but I'd rather focus in how do we get that back together? What do we need to have a functional school department, a functional town? And what do we need to get there? We need to show people that it's exclusions. It's an override.

Point that out. This is what we need.

This is what it's going to take to to get there. This is how it's going to affect your taxes.

And then focusing on that. We don't do a good job of educating the town on how attractive uh I don't want to see my taxes rates go up but how attractive the town's tax rate are. Every once in a while you see something we compare the towns that we don't you know who goes to we compare you know we compared to all these towns that no one's ever been. I

think we need to do a better job. All you got to do is compare to just the towns in the south coast and even Rhode Island because most people travel within 25 20 miles in their home.

They're very familiar with it. They would be shocked what Tivvenant is paying for taxes. They'd be shocked what New Beverford is paying for taxes. And you can I could bring somebody from California who's never been here and they would never know that I drove into Tivan and if I told them it was that we all look the same.

I think that's what we need to focus on.

How what we need to do to get there. And folks, higher taxes is the only way to get there because the state's not doing anything. We can show that with the 10-year graphs of what's happening. But how do we get there? The impact. I think people want to know what the impact and what the end results are. And we can I'm sure point out that our taxes are still going to be less than some of these

communities that we're all very very familiar with. Not these comparable communities we always do that no one's very seldom drives through just because in population and size.

Just some thought.

Thank you, John.

Yes sir.

So I would agree uh and I think the way to set this up at least maybe in part of the letter is to talk about what the options may be going forward.

So the first option is do nothing and we get more potholes and we get more deferred maintenance and it becomes a less interesting place to live. Yep.

Um the second option would be to uh look at efficiency within operations. Uh and we can actually list some of the things. Uh I won't bore you with it, but I've got an eight-page list of just consolidations and uh cut uh cut cost cutting uh within the town. I don't know if they're all possible, but they may be. Some of them may be.

And when you add them all up at the end of the day, they'll give us some uh relief from the taxes. I don't know how much. Uh we can look at things like renegotiating benefit structures. I'm not sure what that means. Uh but maybe u taking a look at it. Uh regional collaborations uh to reduce cost. I know we've talked about this in the past, but what I'm envisioning under these things is to

come up with a list and then make certain people within the administration uh responsible and ask them to write a plan uh with due dates responsibilities etc. And then they have to actually report to somebody um during the year on how well they're doing on all of these things. And then um the idea that we have to find that we're gonna have to as you mentioned consider a um a tax override

and how that fits in and maybe we'll have to consider two tax overrides uh going forward.

Yeah, that would be rough.

New revenue sources.

And so instead of just saying new revenue sources, we have to list all the potential revenue sources and tick off as we go through them.

uh what's possible and what isn't and make those the gists of what the town's going to work on going forward.

And then economic uh development uh to expand the tax base.

And when you get through all those things, you wind up with some kind of composite of different things that are going on which are short-term uh lowhanging fruit. I hate those kind of words. Low hanging fruit that you can work on initially, but then medium-term projects and long-term projects and then ending in what you were just talking about, John, is how do they affect your taxes on an annual basis? If I'm paying

a dollar this year, what am I going to pay next year?

That's really important.

And you also have to put in there uh the effect of uh raising costs on the enterprise funds. So you can have a tax rate uh for your residential taxes, but you then uh which you know you could actually come up with a number, but then you're going to have to really to get the economic impact on the people in town is to put in things like the cost of enterprise funds going up

uh and anything else so that people get a full picture of what it's going to cost to live here going forward in the next 5 to 10 years.

Gary, the two there are three developments in process right now, right? 40B developments.

Um, four, yes, but there are others on in the pipeline.

So, um, permits there are Yeah, I'm not sure how many have been permitted, but uh there are some which we've talked about are going to put pressures on, uh, the schools, they're going to put pressures on, uh, public safety and, uh, utility. And that's what I was going to ask. What is the have they done a study on what what impact on the schools that would be?

So each one does like individual studies. Um we've talked to the schools and administration. They have it on their radar. Uh we've talked to uh uh Jim Kylie and the superintendent when we meet with them uh that they know that that's going to have some impact, but because those have not been fully built yet and the impact hasn't happened, they are projecting that those will have an impact going forward. uh you know

and those will not bring us to 10%.

Right.

Yeah.

I I think it will bring us close. Not sure if it will bring us to the 10% mark.

Uh but as you have these as you have these projects coming in, you know, these are all again costs that we really need to to look at going forward. Um and and with the push to have 40b and affordable housing, uh the pressures are being put on to communities like Dartmouth to we do need more dense housing. We we do need housing that people can live in.

People can't move out of do, you know, the homes they have in Dartmouth and afford to stay.

I have a question that maybe any of you could answer. Is it okay if I of course when we have affordable housing that comes in because like when you have single families, right, I pay taxes and you know those taxes pay for the schools for my children and the fire and the police. But when you have um affordable housing, how does that affect our taxes within this? Like how does that contribute to the town's income?

Like any other uh property, the house is just at a reduced rate. So they pay the tax on whatever the value of that property is reduced rate.

Okay. And from my understanding, they can't sell that property for more than what pretty much what they they paid for. They can't purchase a house for 250,000 and then sell it for 34 of a million.

So that's all controlled.

Uh but um it will bring in new revenue to the town. It's it's not not to say that it won't. Um but it won't bring additional revenue because keep in mind when the levy when we reach that levy capacity, yeah, we can only raise up to that levy. We can't raise an additional. What it does is shifts the burden. So if you add another 100 more units, you're now paying less in tax because

the because the levy is the levy. We can't raise any additional amount to the levy. The only increase to that is a prop 2 and a half override or a debt exclusion which ends up going away after the life of that project.

Is the proposal on on Tucker Road condos for people to buy? Is that on on Tucker Road? From what I my understanding is that it's a mixed um uh where they almost like Lincoln Park the the the building it'll be a combination of single family homes and uh housing complex but the other two are apartments.

Which other two?

The one on Hway Road.

Correct.

Yeah, the pres uh Yeah. And then you have the preserve on Route Six which is the big development where Joe Cycle used to be.

That's right. That's right.

So there there are I believe there are more than three or four right now in the pipeline. I'm not sure on the on the I I'm glad they're not building single houses because single houses use way more service than they pay in taxes, you know. I But um I I understand the concerns that people have. I've been reading about them.

So maybe uh this is another case for sending uh whatever we come up with with that letter to all the department heads including things like zoning uh talking about how important it is to get the right kind of housing here and not want and try and avoid if that's the right word the housing that uh drains a lot of money out of the system right I think and correct me if I'm wrong Gary

but isn't the planning board didn't they do a housing study they did they just did a survey uh survey. Yeah.

Yeah.

And I'm going to touch upon that in my liaison report a little bit.

I think Nate wanted I don't know what I said, but okay.

I love it.

Do the new developments count as new growth? Like is like initial they would for that year they would count for new growth and then it's back to the two and a half.

Yeah.

I think also uh we should be thinking about when we talk about uh consolidations and cost reductions and figuring how to do things on a cheaper basis. Um the big elephant in the room as far as I'm concerned is the school department. Uh 60 whatever it is $60 million worth of stuff. And I think as you were talking about at the last meeting, I think when we get started on

all this stuff, we have to look at various departments and school including the school department and saying we're starting from ground zero. So we really have to understand in in a lot of detail what goes on in the school department and what what opportunities are for regionalization, cost cutting, cost sharing with the town, etc. So almost like a uh diagnostic analysis of what goes on uh in the school department.

The um the department that sorry dispatch dispatch has been done regionally in many places. So that would be one way talking about police dispatch.

Yeah, police department dispatch. Yeah, that's very small.

Um special ed would be hard to regionalize. I think I don't know how they would do that.

Yeah, that's the conversation you'd have to have with the administration. Yes. So, we're getting all the money that we're supposed to get from those um second homes.

Yeah. Personal property.

Yeah.

Yes.

Okay.

There are communities where we explored um uh that there's a different tax status that they they um could potentially be taxed at.

Uh after speaking with the the board of assessors and they're doing more they're doing more research on this communities like I think they look we looked at Dennis for instance. Um they've done that but they've done it for decades decades. And um I don't know if there was special legislation that was passed that to allow them to do that.

It was but we would potentially maybe have to do that or um uh see if we're taxed at the max that we can tax that for those homes. Now if you own a second home, you pay that tax for owning that second home if your doicile is not, you know, if you don't register to vote here. So if you let's say you have a house in Boston, you have a house here,

you pay that you pay the personal property on that on that home. Uh and also it involves if you own a business, the equipment in the business. So there's a lot of things but we have explored that um with other other communities.

So follow up with respect to um the school conversation.

Um, after last week's meeting, I contacted Jim because again, I can, you know, talk a lot and so I had some questions specifically for Jim. And it involved what's called schedule 19. And schedule 19 is a schedule on the end of the year per pupil financial reports that everyone in Jim's position is to fill out each and every fiscal year that talks about the expenses of the school department paid by the town. And that

schedule 19 is published each and every year. And it captures for example part of uh the administrative cost for Gary and for Cody and for everybody in this building. It picks up uh transportation costs. It picks up debt, any short-term debt. It picks up your rans. It picks up anything that we're ranting, tanning, or banning, which is all you're borrowing out of your treasury. It picks up any

and all revenue. That's why I called out Medicare. Medicaid is revenue generated by the school, but we have to report it on the schedule 19. and everything else that's in here. Health insurance at $5 million, your employee retirement contributions at $1.7 million, your health insurance, etc., etc. So, all of these associated costs are added to education and added to the appropriation

by the town andor town meeting. And so, you when you add that, that's 19.9 andor $20 million of additional costs for your education. It's 60 60 million in the school budgets and another 19 million on top of that.

On top of that, they take services from um the town.

We don't take services from the town.

No. So, for example, if Gary and I are having a meeting over the school budget, if I did a bubble sheet, I'm like, how long did we meet? How long have we been meeting over the years? What's that? 20% of the time, 40% of the time we spend on meeting or your salary. I'm going to capture the cost of his salary. So I might take the total 1,000 series and

say the total cost of town hall is X and a portion Y is calculated to be a cost to the school department. So we already agree through a schedule 19 that's agreed upon by the school committee and the board of selectment. So they already agree that schedule 19 which is an annual filing by the school department by Chim Jim. He's been doing it for 20 years. It's agreed upon between the

parties is part of your per pupil cost that you saw. That's still low compared to the state average in the averages that you are seeing. So my point is when you go to look at your educational costs, every last red cent that you pay for a number two pencil, Gary's time, the building department's time, we're all required to report the total costs of public education to the state. and it

comes in your your um effort to pay and all of those kinds of things. But I just wanted to point out to the group that the three folks Gary, Cody, Jim are meeting with respect to capturing annually. This is audited. And I almost fell off my chair when I asked Jim, who's your auditors? He said the town.

The town is auditing. So the town has to audit this each and every year. and Jim has told me they're the same town 10 I'm sorry they're the same auditors for the last 10 years even though the the company has been sold or built or whatever. Um my point is is we've had this I think you were going to correct her.

Well, but no wait my my point is I'm not getting the point of my my point is Thank you so much. My point is the audits of the school department come into play when every last red scent not only by the school department but also by the town which has been agreed upon by the parties is audited. There's something called the comprehensive program review. Your title one grants are audited. Your title two

is audited. Your title 2A is audited.

Your title n is audited. This is audited. Your end of the year report is audited. And the point is you can take a look at the audits to see what we could possibly regionalize within that if in fact there's something within that. But when I had heard about the uh staffing study to the police saying why don't you do a staffing study or why don't you could do some audits or maybe

we can do some comprehensive analysis there. I followed up with Jim saying, "Jim, don't you do your audits?" And who are you doing your audits?

That's not what I referenced at all.

Oh, I don't I'm referencing the the I think we're maybe we're getting a little um off topic on the letter. All I can say is that Yeah, we're talking about the letter. So I all I can the only comment I will make is that sorry um you know when we we prepare this the uh the end of year report and we supply that to the schools it takes into consideration a lot of the

uh costs that um as you know for instance let's take healthcare for instance uh the town picks up that entire tab on the townside budget so uh they report that to the retirement everything gets everything gets allocated uh I don't know too much about the schedule 19 that's really a school document uh but when we do the uh end of year we're encompassing a lot of those uh costs. Um I think with the meeting uh

from last time that we met, it wasn't really talking about a financial audit.

We're talking more of about an efficiency audit.

Thank you.

Right. And so when we have the books audited, when we have our annual audit and we present that to the select board, it looks at all the data and all the financials that the schools have. You know, they have a lot of grants. They're looking at that. So that's really the town audit, uh which encompasses the schools. are looking at all that to make sure that proper expenditures are being

done. They're not charging something to the wrong grant. Uh so that's all uh reconciled back.

I did ask Jim to look at this with you because this should be agreed upon voted by the parties in order to submit it to the state. So it might be committee and board of selectment is my point.

I'm not sure if the board of selectment Yes, they do. Look at that. I' I'd have to look at the rules, but I could talk to Jim about it.

That's okay. it because it doesn't have for example your police I'm sorry it doesn't have your school resource officer you should agree that this is what you're providing to the schools is my point it's a great exercise yeah I'm not sure I'm not sure if it's I'm not sure if it's required by the board of selective design I'd have to look into it I talked to Jim about it great uh we we'll have the convers to

make sure that everybody agreed on the school town costs associated because we're working collaborative was one Dartmouth that's kind of my point isn't This a one Dartmouth thing, guys. We're telling you what we're spending. It's a one Dartmouth thing for me. Thank you.

Sorry. Thank you for your time. I'm done.

Um Oh my god. Check.

We've talked about it a couple of times, but could we uh do the indirect cost for the fire departments for everything that you do?

The districts, h the complete districts. They act as their own towns. actually town within the town their own they have their own meeting and they certify their own free cash. So there's been discussions over the years. this is predates me uh you know over the decades that the um districts have been uh you know in place but there's been no um no I know that there hasn't been but I I

I would like to find out if we can build them if the town can build the fire districts for all the administrative work or if not can that administrative work be sent back to the fire districts that would be have that would have to be if if an agreement is going take place.

It would have to be agreed upon by both the town and the and the district and the districts.

There would have to be some kind of agreement in place that says, you know, we're we're going to we're going to now go forward in this fashion.

There's no incentive for them to to do anything.

What would the benefit be of them doing it?

We do.

How much?

We build for them.

Yes. Well, you get the tax district.

We do a lot of stuff in town for those districts that we don't charge them for.

Okay.

I don't It's not that much, but we do.

We do something. So the idea would be to build them back since they're they're like enterprise funds. They they get their own money from raising their own fees.

If I may. Yes.

Every once in a while we tend to veer off and talk about fire districts which are none of our by the way. They have their own committee.

That's right.

John knows he's on one of the committees.

I'm just thinking about more.

No, no. I understand what you're saying.

Um, I I beg of you actually because they all will have annual meetings coming up.

They're all usually in April. Go, please go to your fire district meeting and learn something about your fire district. They will have a warrant. They will have articles. They will tell you how they spend their budgets. I will tell you this little fun fact because I happen to know someone who's on the credential committee for fire district 1. Um, that's my district.

Good. Um, at one time they did offer to pay the town. I can't speak for the other two districts. I'll defer to I haven't been there long.

You probably haven't been there long enough. They did offer to pay for the administrative costs. Do not assume it's millions of dollars. It's not.

Um, that's what I was wondering. The one, right? So, the other two districts, my understanding is they did not agree. So, nothing happened. That's that the the district didn't like the whole idea or the two other districts. District two and three and two have a very small budget but three is the one that has a huge budget, right?

Well, I think probably more so, but I for some reason or other people think that if the fire districts didn't exist that somehow the town would have a big benefit. Here's the big benefit. You would assume many employees that would now you would now be responsible for their health care, their pensions, etc. And it would not be inexpensive and now they work on their own.

There's my rant.

I want to point out that ultimately this is you you save the taxpayer nothing.

No, it just shifts, right? Yes. the taxes in the districts will go up and and the cost for the town go down, but your taxes will never go in that town. So, you just Well, it's still coming from the same I'm not so sure substantially, John, because they would be full-time employees, and that doesn't exist today except for the chiefs.

No, no, no. That's you're talking some I'm the Terry started out with administrative right stuff that the town does for the fire district. Yeah.

Well, and you you're still going to pay for in your fire taxes whether you're paying for it here or there. And to be quite honest with you, you can imagine now three smaller departments try to do the same thing that the town did on a much larger scale at a better price than your three districts could do at a smaller scale. So ultimately, it may cost the taxpayer even more money to And I'm not trying to

I'm part of the district. I'm I'm not trying to say don't it it doesn't matter to me either way. That's good information.

The taxpayer is going to have to pay it, right?

I think this is a this is one of these projects that wind up on the list someplace and it may be down a little bit further, but I think it's worth exper looking at because it, you know, at le you'd have one chief.

Oh, now that's consolidation is a different topic. No doubt. Oh, I'm all for consolidation will absolutely save the time money. No question about it.

No question about it. But they're three separate I know agenda back to the agenda.

Please consolidation.

I'm going to be quiet.

Well, the fire districts are not in our control and they're not in the town.

They're not on our agenda.

They're not in our control. They're not on our agenda.

How I feel about it's not up to the town to take them over.

Fire.

That's how I feel about fire. Every time we talk about this, it's not it's not our concern. It's not our agenda.

It's not our concern. I would like somebody besides committee people giving their opinions to tell me factually that there's a reason why we can't talk about doing whatever we need to do to the fire districts and I don't know what that means.

It's my understanding and once again I beg of you to go to fire districts one meeting.

I don't care. I would like I would like to the town cannot take over the fire departments. Am I right Gary? The town cannot say, "I will take over the fire department."

Yeah, you're absolutely correct. And Brian, I'm I'm I'm with you 100% that consolidation will save the town money.

But the issue is you got district one, which you're in.

Yeah.

Very attractive tax rate. I think you're at 50 cents of something a thousand.

You got a larger population. District two has got the most what I'm in and I'm on the committee has got the most expensive. We're at a dollar three now.

You try merging these together. Your district is going to say no. And district three is somewhere in the middle. Let's say sh they're at 75. So we got 50 75 and a dollar. You merge all those. You're going to be paying a lot more money. We've got to convince your district Yeah.

to consolidate that this is a good thing. Yeah, that's going to be a tough I don't think that's going to fly, John.

Exactly.

It's a tough pill for your jurisdiction to swallow. So, let's not do anything.

And that's the way it's been for years, unfortunately.

Moving on.

So, um the uh I'll give some information that uh some of the items that we uh obviously Cody's not here, so I'll I'll brief the uh the committee on some of the things that we've been working on.

Um so on 317 we'll be going to be having um the final meeting of the uh capital improving plan uh CIPC will um parks and recck will be there. We'll also be talking about um the master plan that's been put together. They'll make the recommendations at that meeting and we also have some candidates because we have some open slots on that meeting.

We'll be interviewing those. I sent those to the committee so they can look at the CIPC committee. Um and then um on 319 we have the budget advisory group uh and uh schools will be giving their uh budget presentation and also talking about their fixed costs at that meeting.

We've also been uh busy with uh the we had a meeting uh today for the health insurance steering committee.

Uh we have looked at a couple options.

Um it looks very favorable that if we can if things line up, if the stars line up as they say, uh we could make be making some progress on that. Obviously time is of the essence. we have to want to do this by July 1st. Uh so we've uh talked to a local group. We've talked to a couple of groups actually, but we've talked to a local group where this there would be substantial savings for both

the town and the employees. Uh we met with all the major um unions and membership, uh one member of the retirees group, um Cody and myself, and then um a couple other individuals that were involved. Chris O'Neal represented the select board. Uh so we had some really good conversation today.

We'll continue to work with our consultant to see if what the time frame would be. Obviously, we have to get the buyin from the from the unions to do this, but I think we have some pretty good um traction with that to move this along. So that's continuing to be working to for us to be consultant Gary.

Uh well, we use uh Gallagher. Well, the group the group so the local group had already invited us into the into their group. They use Gallagher right now. We use uh Cooking Company.

Okay. So, uh, that's who our because we we use Maya. So, we have obviously, you know, we're in Maya. So, um, we we have, um, they use they use we have a certain consultant that we use with them, but if we were to switch groups, it would be a different consultant.

Um, thank you.

So, we're trying to mitigate the cost there with with switching over. Uh, on 317 at our next meeting, uh, I've contacted Voke, so they'll be coming in to do a presentation and talk about the assessments. um in the past. 3:17 our next finance committee meeting next week.

317 I think 17 is Tuesday.

Oh 319. Okay. Sorry about that. 319.

Yeah.

So we are meeting the 19th, right? You'll have the presentation with with um Vogue. Uh they'll come in. Um I asked um Mr. Watson to give us a brief explanation about the assessment uh in the past going forward what he sees for any future projects, expansions at the school. I think that would be good to know that we can plan ahead. As you know, we pay the assessment for folks.

So, I thought it'd be good and they haven't been in a while. So, he was excited to come in for the whole budget, not just the assessment.

Yeah, I can email him.

Whole budget. Thank you.

Uh and um uh so we'll have that on on the uh on the 19th. Other than that, that's what we have going forward uh going on uh currently.

If you're talking about the next week's agenda, can you put our um finance committee handbook back on it? put the handbook back on. Okay, thank you.

Unfortunately, I will not be able to be here next week.

Heads up.

Okay, thank you.

I have another item to put on the agenda.

The Dartmouth Public Schools is doing their annual spelling bee.

Oh, and the the opportunities are that we we could be a team. We could dress up and be a team and go and compete.

Or we could um donate money. Last year people donated $20 each. Or we could not do it. And I'm not going to ask you tonight. So next week I'm going to ask you. So you bring some money because you you're the worst.

What kind of outfit?

What is it, Terry?

I I'm not I'm not dressing up. No way.

Because she asked us to be a coin. When it What is it, Terry?

What's it?

What is it?

When is it?

Uh I I'll tell you next week. I don't know.

It's fun.

We all go like Munchkins.

It is fun. It's fun to watch even if you don't.

It It is fun. I've won. They're very competitive.

I think that would be fantastic.

If we did it, I do too.

Have a finance committee.

It could be a team.

Spelling be is like a team event. It's like a team thing.

Spell. It's awful. Oh, no.

I will not win the competition. I promise you that. But it could be fun just in terms of decimal in terms of like getting involved.

Taking us out of room 315 and into the community like a fantastic idea.

Be a gold.

They only need three people. They don't need all of us obviously. So if three people here want to do it, I will let them know. But don't tell me they're doing it. I want you to roll it around in your brain and think about it. And then next week I'll ask you.

I love it.

Okay.

I love it.

I don't want any emotional.

I need a date though.

I know.

Kind of need to know when it is without knowing a date.

And I'm sorry, Terry. I thought it was more than $20 a piece. No, last year.

Yeah. No, I my recollection is 20. But you can give more if you want to, but I think I don't remember the amount that we agreed upon.

Yeah. Okay.

Where do you want all this money?

Next Thursday. Next Thursday. Bring some cash.

Good. Right.

Bring some cash.

Terry's one of the few people on the planet I write a check to.

It's because of that. She doesn't do Venmo or any of those cool things. No, she I don't do Venmo. I don't want to do it.

Please, please, just if you could just give me the cash.

I do have it, but I have no clue how to put it together. Nothing happened. You would all go on Venmo and say give you $20.

Just wire you the money. You'd get it instantly and then you could even say I'll do it cuz my nephew gave me a tutorial showed me how to go in the senior center. You sit down 15 minutes.

She'll load it right up for you.

All right. We'll talk about it next week.

We'll talk about it next week.

Talk about off topic.

It wasn't on the agenda, so can't talk about it tonight.

That's right. Next week. Next week.

Gary's going to put that on the agenda for next week.

Use Venmo.

How to use Venmo.

What else? What else are we doing?

Venmo. Say it again.

How to use spelling be public school spelling be.

That's the short version of what we just hashed over for 15 minutes.

Delegation to the spelling be and donation.

That's funny.

I think we should have a team.

I do too.

Depends when it is.

It would be kind of fun.

I think it'd be hilarious up.

It's your fin.

We're asking for a lot of money upcoming in overrides and underrides and dedicated.

Had enough of this discussion.

Sorry, not Terry.

No, you mean but we need a date so it doesn't it's irrelevant to know whether people can do it.

Somebody Yeah, somebody sent me the date. I'll put it on there.

Okay.

Terry will Terry can look it up.

Leaison reports.

Leaison reports. Who's got one?

I do. Um got to talk louder. Carrie.

Um I do. So the I I talked about the it was on my liaison report to talk about the schedule 19 and the audits because I just followed up after last um week's presentation with Jim because I picked up a couple things. So I wanted to present that to you. Um there's one thing on here that involves FY26 and Cody's not here so I I kind of want to follow up with Cody and um Gary in

respect to it's FY26.

It's the police staffing uh study report for $60,000.

Um right now sitting here today, as you know, the police department um is going to be returning approximately $750,000 this year in FY26. It's available right now. Um, I am proposing, I am advocating, I am doing what I can do as a non-town meeting member, finance committee member, trying to show a little leadership here by saying if it's on his capital list, it's not a capital item. It's a contracted service. It's a

study. What do we So all I really want to do, I swear to God, all I really want to do is does the department head, in this case, the police chief have the ability to do a line item transfer from available salaries, which right now is $750,000 for the purposes of sole purpose to do a police study, a police staffing study to be available to us for FY28 budgeting after you have a comprehensive

ive salary agreement. You've got a contract in agreement and now you have a staffing agreement ready for FY28 budgeting. So you just built yourself a bridge by using FY26 money transfer from salary to contracted service chief to start his study and that's a dollar fordoll value. you wait till you fund it out of capital because you're funding capital out of certified free cash which

certified free cash is residual monies from the previous fiscal year. So when you certify November's free cash you're using the $750,000 available to you right now. Then you call that capital and you say in the spring of 27 let's fund 28's capital. So the value of that dollar is now.7.

All I'm suggesting is do the study right now out of the available funds instead of rolling it into free cash waiting to certify it no in in November after you do your snow and ice calculation.

And it's dollar for dollar. It gives you it gives Cody the management tool that he needs to manage. It gives the department the management tool that they need to manage. It gives the police chief exactly what he's been offered asking for on the Brian form.

May I ask a question?

Of course.

Can I clarify a couple things?

Sure.

So, um just a couple things. The certified free cash is the the available funds are already there. So, we're not waiting till the fall. Uh secondly, that was the practice in in prior years. And uh what what we had heard from town meeting members was the level of transparency wasn't there. uh you know we go to town meeting with items that we feel that are capital this being one of

them uh uh CIPC has met uh they presented that the police chief presented that to us uh so the transparency is that town meeting sees that a study is being done if we're moving money between accounts that disappears off the warrant town meeting doesn't see that but in this particular case as leaders looking for solutions to bridge a problem that we have here and now. So in bold and I'll gladly send you my report

tonight. In bold I'm writing how can Fincom make comma advocate comma or suggest a line item transfer in the FY26 police department budget of $60,000 from salary to expense contracted services for the sole purposes of performing a police department staffing study for the town of Dartmouth.

It would be exactly what it be would align that ship and you do it right now and it's not capital.

We do we do line item transfers. Finance committee does line item transfers uh at the end of the fiscal year once we see what balances are left but typically they're for uh you know somebody overspent on their uh you know utility charges. Uh but but I think going back to my first comment of the transparency of having it go to town meeting having it um vetted out uh you know town meeting

could say no we don't we don't want to fun that can they do this June 2nd as soon as as soon as it gets approved at town meeting the funds are available July 1st. So it's really not going to that's not going to change much.

But I'm sorry I when would So this June 2nd town meeting the police department is moving a study for the police department staffing that will start on June 3rd if approved at town meeting.

Right. It's a it's a it's a CIPC warrant audit.

So why is it on his 28th request?

28.

What are you talking about?

It's on his 28 capital requests.

Uh, no, that was on his that was on his capital request for this year.

Right.

You just met with us.

Yeah, I saw that. I watched the meeting.

I heard the conversation about whether or not it was a capital first meeting that says town compensation FY vehicles 27 and the study 28 CIP right there 28. So this is all I was and again I'm reading I'm listening I'm I'm making my comments but if in fact on June 2nd we can move the police department study forward from some town manager mating member whomever that would benefit the town tremendously

and I just saw it in FY28 and so I was advocating for start earlier. Yeah, you're only talking about 28 days difference between uh if we were to do that and town meeting because on July 1st if those funds are available and approved at town meeting from from uh reserve uh from free cash which they are um and the and keep in mind CIPC still has to make that recommendation. So they haven't

made that recommendation yet and if they are available on July 1st the chief could go and and and start that study.

And is there some way that we can positively encourage that? And and do we vote on these things?

No, no, that's a CIPC. Well, we we will vote on we will vote one way. CPC recommends it, we can make our recommendation. So, if we if we and we had this discussion in the fall, right? Um about how do do we agree and support with the recommendation that's made by CIPC? So we will have an opportunity to review the recommendation that CIPC has made, say whether or not we agree with

it. We can vote in favor for it. We can vote in opposition to it and we can write our rationale to justify either one of those.

Oh, we can we our rale is is written every on all the um great um so that's what I was going to hold off on and speak to Cody first because I wasn't sure but I think we've we've beaten that dead horse and we fully understand my real desire to make that happen.

Um I attended so we have a board of public works with three members. It's going to five once town meeting approves it but gentlemen when they meet for the purposes of conducting interviews they have to post the meeting because all three of them in the same room. So on Tuesday, I actually got buzzed in the door at DPW and attended the meeting of the board of public works for the purposes of interviewing engineering

firm. And the engineering firm that they uh they interviewed was Tai and Bon and they were responding to a request for a proposal for a comprehensive wastewater program review.

Um they are looking at wastewater, storm water, surface water, all the existing conditions of all the facilities, all pumping stations, all 22 of them. Issues in high density areas in Dartmouth.

Facility capacities will be analyzed and options associated and costs developed in uh 2027.

The comprehensive program review would be the basis of some DP interestf free loans available to Dartmouth. So by doing this now, we're positioning ourselves for potential funding for some of these things and the conformity with the myriad of regulations that are changing on these guys all the time. Um it's a whole different language when you start talking PFAS and all sorts of other

nitrogen levels and things like that.

The last comprehensive review on this property in this manner was done in 2011 and they've been using that plan as a baseline for decision making as far as planning on an annual basis. So this would piggy back right uh from that and and it'd be a nice nice um opportunity for us with respect to the 40B projects in respect to what we can do with zoning and building and things like that. We were in the conference

room and then there's always the the round table with the guys, the tech guys and the real worker guys that know the engineering and how to make this stuff work and they they were talking to the engineers because in these qualifications you have to be qualified and see the guys were tossing questions on them left and right and I'm very impressed with Tim Barker.

So these guys were talking how come some of these issues that we have aren't we we're not being heard and that's my word specifically garbage disposals.

The garbage disposals in your dense areas such as what's just been built over on Dartmouth Street is causing in a dense areas some of headend issues with your water issues, your sewer issues. if he didn't have garbage disposals in that entire complex that would lower the possibility of of capacity issues, etc., etc. And so when he was talking about it, he talked about, well, building's

really great, but the zoning and by the time we get to zoning, the 40 days during design development has already occurred and there's nothing you can do because it's all wired up. So, some of those kinds of things I heard from the staff. Wouldn't it be really great if we could hear better, and that's my words, more communications between the departments. There are some overlays

because they're um enterprise funds that maybe they're not getting to the top of the pile with building or top of the pile with sewer. Um because I heard garbage disposal are kind of a problem and I heard grease traps. The grease traps aren't hiding. I think degrees outside of our but it's it's my liaison report and it talks about just excuse me may I interrupt yes of course so liaison reports while that's very

detailed no doubt oh my god details having having once been the DPW liaison anywhere you have to understand but it's about bringing forward to us something that really might be a concerning financial issue concerned about the enterprise funds.

What's coming down the road that no one seems I mean and it's me that when I hear people talking at these meetings saying we're on our loan enterprise funds there is a massive amount of money coming out of the enterprise funds and here's the other thing we know that because there was a presentation at the select asking the same pool of people 34,500 voters there are 11,000 structures here

in town that some are some paid a betterment to hook up that you've got a capacity issues with the Betterment that you've hooked up. So, finance committee.

I'm saying there's a problem here. It's enterprise funds. This is votes. This is votes for your override. It's votes for your all sorts of things. And the last thing I'll say is this DPW staff is recovering from snowageddon. They've been out and about. They're back to their wives and children. And I also wanted to thank Cody for all his social media contacts and the number of enterprises. And the last thing last

last thing is the Ziterion on June 14th at 3:00 which is a Sunday has the US Coast Guard Band and it's a free concert on a Sunday in the summer in downtown New Bedford. And if you haven't seen the Coast Guard Band, it is so much fun. So, I I I throw that out to everybody as well and I sent it to Matt over at the veterans um department and said, "Grab

the van." So, that's the report and I'll email it to you so you guys all have it.

Thank you.

It's been a busy week. There have been 14 meetings this week. I've tried to get as many physically as I can. Hello, my name is Dearra and I'm going to email you this because this is the specifications for the RFQ. It's fascinating what this is studying and it's very costly. 50 80 and there's no MSBA for this stuff. There's just interest free loans and rate payers for those that are hooked up that we're

going to ask for vote to a new roof in a new school and to vote for our operating. So we are one Dartmouth.

Thank you very much.

Thank you Dra.

You're welcome.

Do you repeat that?

Thank you.

No words left.

I'm going to email this to you.

Um John, did you want to give a brief overview of this? review.

We're going to put a time limit on.

I only say that because the meeting was three and a half hours long.

Um CPC entertained five applications totaling over $3.6 million. So, um we'll be seeing those uh at Springtown meeting.

CPC is voting um next week on the projects, but I suspect all of them will be approved. the money's there. We are certainly depleting it, but so you'll be seeing those a lot of money, a lot of a lot of uh applicants this uh this round.

Something we can't sustain, but were there any um that continues?

Yes. Okay.

It was impressive.

Three half hours.

Impressive. will say you should especially before a buddy comes before us anyway and talks about these projects but if you have the opportunity to watch that meeting you will see the full presentations of all those projects so it's well worth it to get a real inside you know look at what those projects were each person came up and talked about their particular project yeah as we do the article review

um we invite Buddy in to speak on those Buddy does a very brief recap and of course allows questions but that's great background for you just in case you want hear the details. Did you have a leazison report?

Nope. Hasn't been I don't really have to give a liazison report for the libraries because that was a beautiful they were here and their only their one of their concerns is their elevator and the water issue.

Yes.

So that's being resolved obviously and Carrie.

No. Thank you Terry.

Ryan uh just again we'll have vote next week.

So, um, I'll put that on with the, uh, handbook. I'm not sure how long their pres presentation will last, but I'm sure we'll have some questions for them, especially if they're talking about, uh, plans going forward, whatever they have going forward for products.

The handbook will be a brief conversation.

$20 outfits.

I do have one thing to say, please.

Um, it'll take me just a minute. Bob when he was with us um on the committee had started actuals and I'd like to continue that because I found it 100% you Oh, good. I was just looking at them.

Oh, did you send it? We have that in the uh letter.

Yeah, also.

Yes, that's No, it'll stay in the letter and I've seen them. Gary sent them to me a little while ago.

Instead of doing all that budget, but I just got it from I had requested it from him. So, uh, what Bob focused on, uh, when he was here was, um, you know, the actuals for the revenues, uh, and expenses and brought those out. We continue to, I sent the spreadsheet to, um, Janine. I don't think if I sent every couple weeks ago, you didn't send it to everybody because

I looked for it to uh, and focus on the actuals, which really in turn is what we build the budget on. Um yeah, you know, and right now with the budget, uh we we still are looking at the 113299 for uh the revenues. Uh we're still continuing to talk to the schools. We have the budget advisory group uh next week.

So, as I mentioned in the last meeting, I think that that final number and whatever that percentage is that we are able to to give to the schools, uh we can tweak that as we go forward, but I would say that it's going to go right up until Yeah.

uh you know, the last minute. not I don't want to say last minute but where where in maybe in the past couple years we we settled that in in March or April.

So I'm thinking that it's going to be because there's so many discussions going on a lot of discussion going on.

We're trying to get it as close as we can uh to to fill some of their needs. Uh but the the conversation continues with them.

What do you do with changes in chapter 70 that might come out of the Senate?

Well, so once they release the Senate House Ways and Means, we adjust those revenue uh I'll adjust my revenue numbers for those. Uh so right now we have plugged in whatever the governor's budget was but what the fear is I think talking about state aid is when what the fear is that as we get closer to the end of the fiscal year we know that there's a revenue problem with the with the state

what is going to happen in the house ways and means budget the senate budget are they going to adjust that down we were hoping we hope that it's going to at least remain level from last year uh we don't want to see it in decrease you know so those estimates So those are what I'm talking about could change that revenue number.

Um also, you know, potentially savings from health insurance. So this these are all fluid things that are going on.

That's why I can't tell you right now that Yeah, this is absolutely set in stone. We Cody and I and and the schools are still working on this.

There'll be there'll be plenty of meetings between now and Thank you, Gary. I I just wanted to bring up the actuals because for me, for my brain, when I see the actuals over the past few years, it makes it clearer of, you know, when we say that we really don't have the money for the schools, when you look at these actuals, it's it's right here in black and white. So,

I think it's it's more transparent and I think that the public can see we're doing the best we can.

Yeah. I mean, like I said, we you know, we're limited to the we're limited to the state with local receipts. limited to um well local receipts on our level with motor vehicle. We explained that last week. We're limited with the sources of uh revenue for um state aid and then we're limited with the amount that we can actually tax, you know, uh and and we don't collect 100%. We're 99% delinquency. So 1% of that levy is

really uncollectible, you know.

Uh so it it it's difficult it's difficult to um to get to the point where we can say like today this is what this is what's set in stone. So we're still continue to work with the schools.

Do we need to the presentation that and I know Cody sent it to everybody. The presentation that he gave us.

Yes. um that he has a conversation directly with us and maybe answer some questions directly about that presentation.

I I wouldn't put it on for the for the I wouldn't put it on for the 19th because I might be a little bit with the with Voke.

Yeah.

Uh I think maybe the following meeting on the 26th.

Yeah.

We include that.

No, I think because people want to have the opportunity to talk about it. I'm sure you've all seen the slides and we forward it. Uh we you have it, right Jenny?

Cody sent it to everybody.

Okay. We have Y.

Yeah. So you have it, you can chew on it and develop all your questions.

And there will be something on the warrant. There'll be a request for debt for the plan according to the what was discussed at the meeting. There'll be there'll be something for the uh we want to put the enterprise funds on for the high school roof.

That's still we're still working on that. That's we had a time to go out for a high school roof with the oil prices. Well, we're hoping that that might come down by then. It's already it's already started to come down.

Already started the process. So, it's kind of got to go forward at this point.

Once you're in feasibility with MSBA, you pretty much bought yourself a project.

No, I agree. It's done.

So, we have a you know, we have a lot of irons in the fire. We're working on a lot of things uh both Cody and I to try to mitigate a lot of these costs in the short term, but you know, as we look at the debt stuff, these are all long-term projects obviously. So, um and those are paid on the as you know, the rates.

And do you have any idea? I know it's kind of a question that's you probably don't have an answer to um when we might see a draft of the warrant.

Uh we um I believe Cody is putting that together. So uh those articles have to be submitted to the select I forget the date on the uh the date to be on the select board March 31st.

I don't know if it's on the 30th. I got the calendar. I can circulate that again to the committee. Um but once we start to get that, we'll hopefully um beginning of um April, we're almost there. We'll start looking at a draft.

Then the final piece will be the um I think C I think CIPC will be wrapped up next week and the recommendations will be made. So that'll be one article that's out of the way.

Uh the budget will be uh schedule A will be we be presented and then it'll be just whatever article. I haven't seen a draft yet of the of the warrant.

I figure it just because of the conversation at the select board meeting that it was still Yeah, it's still in up in the air.

Yeah, we'll we'll definitely get that to the committee once we can for review.

Okay. Um, it'll be a busy April.

Yeah, that's for sure.

Busy already. And speaking of April, do we meet over April school vacation?

We meet whenever we have to between now and April school vacation. Okay.

Whenever a letter has to be mailed. Um, we're usually done by middle of May.

Usually because the date because of the dates of everything having to be done. We're usually done by the middle of May. So if you looked at the calendar, if you looked at the calendar, we have one, two, three, four, five.

Yeah. And those meetings tend to be longer.

Although this like nine, 10 meetings and there's always the potential for a Tuesday night meeting in there as well.

That's right.

If we need it, depending on how things go forward at this point. But yeah, by midMay we've every deadline's passed so we have to go. And then of course the town meeting.

We're expected to be at the town meeting.

Yeah. So the goal is I think in May have a draft of the warrant, maybe even make recommendations then wrap that up by the end of April and then have a good two weeks to work on the on the letter.

Yeah. Um okay. No minutes at this point.

No minutes for this meeting.

Okay. All right. Any other quick is the key word um item to bring up.

Is that a no?

No.

Somebody want to make a motion to adjurnn?

I'll make the motion to adjurnn.

Second.

Second by Nick. All in favor?

I I Thank you.

Any opposed? No.

I hear none. How many